Crystal Meth

"VAs are too strong!" "Evokers are too weak!" "Nerf Kinu!"
A place for all your ideas and woes regarding game balance.
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Grandpa
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Crystal Meth

Post by Grandpa » Mon Feb 26, 2018 2:40 am

Crystal Rose is incredibly strong. Too much so to be as large of an AoE it is, in my opinion. We're not even discussing how ludicrous it is for an AoE to score critical hits today.

I have a few ideas on how to fix this.

One, crystal rose could be toned down- have the scaled weapon attack or ice attack lowered by a fair chunk. Duelists are always going to have a large amount of ice attack for skill so they can hit, so lowering that to even something like 30% would still net them a fair amount of damage.

Two, crystal rose's size could be lowered by one, or even two squares. I think that would be fair, given how insane you can get the damage output to be.
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Lolzytripd
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Re: Crystal Meth

Post by Lolzytripd » Mon Feb 26, 2018 3:16 am

if anything it should be balanced in comparison to kensei aoes

MegaBlues
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Re: Crystal Meth

Post by MegaBlues » Mon Feb 26, 2018 3:32 am

Kensei is a promo, and its skills are lines and point-blanks, with a single oddly-shaped crescent, and require a katana to not cost 4m. They should be higher damage to compensate.

As for Crystal Rose, I think that lowering the AoE size to match Holy Spark or unenchanted Sear would be perfectly fine, as well as lowering the Elemental ATK scaling by 10% and the SWA scaling by 20% for all ranks.

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Re: Crystal Meth

Post by Spoops » Mon Feb 26, 2018 3:33 am

Lowering the AoE would probably help a lot with Crystal Rose's biggest problem cases, namely being Blazing and Swift variants.

Blazing Crystal Rose lays down old sear levels of cinders worth 50% fire ATK, it overall is very oppressive to face against.

Swift Crystal Rose does more damage than regular basic attack crits at some times, it scales pretty hard and is AoE as well.

I don't think the skill should be over-nerfed into uselessness though, at the very least, Lightning Criticals are its BIGGEST offender and thats only because Swift Crystal Rose's damage is pretty much the best in the game cause it scales harder than any other physical autohit probably can.

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Re: Crystal Meth

Post by MegaBlues » Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:22 am

Crystal Rose, at the moment, has scaling comparable to many other AoE promo spells, for a much cheaper cost, that can't be silenced. And compared other base class skills, the damage is very high. I think a damage nerf is justified.

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Spoops
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Re: Crystal Meth

Post by Spoops » Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:28 am

the skill itself doesn't do all that much damage it just does a proportionate amount for a swift AoE, the cinders sort of explain themself.

70% Ice Scaling with 100% SWA isn't all that much compared to spells, especially when you consider Physical damage just has more vastly easier to access mitigation than magic damage.

No one complains about raging/quaking/regular crystal rose, they only complain about Swift and Blazing, because Swift does way too much damage and Blazing just forms a shit ton of cinders that are hard to play around.

If not lowering the AoE or damage, doing the following would be the most effective:

-Change blazing crystal rose's cinders to 25% Fire ATK

-Change swift crystal rose to deal half critical damage, for its AoE nature. (lightning should be single target, like overload/ryemei/rye)

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Lolzytripd
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Re: Crystal Meth

Post by Lolzytripd » Mon Feb 26, 2018 3:45 pm

MegaBlues wrote:Kensei is a promo, and its skills are lines and point-blanks, with a single oddly-shaped crescent, and require a katana to not cost 4m. They should be higher damage to compensate.

As for Crystal Rose, I think that lowering the AoE size to match Holy Spark or unenchanted Sear would be perfectly fine, as well as lowering the Elemental ATK scaling by 10% and the SWA scaling by 20% for all ranks.


they are in an odd spot

100%swa +70% elemental attack VS 140% swa.

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Re: Crystal Meth

Post by Chaos » Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:00 pm

I think the core issue lies more with the absurd power that AoEs bring to the table over single-target skills in most cases. Crystal Rose is just a very accessible case with Elemental Augment, and its base form isn't even that powerful compared to a handful of other AoEs.

I would not lower Crystal Rose's power specifically, since it's the Elemental Augments that make the skill overused. You'll want to adjust those, rather than trying to smack its scalings/range for reasons that don't even exist.

However, I'd rather just focus on adjusting all AoEs in general over just throttling one of them, Crystal Rose or otherwise.
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[12:53:15 AM] Chaos: don't hit dyst
[12:53:18 AM] Chaos: that's cruelty to animals
[12:53:20 AM] Chaos: you have to shoot it
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Spoops
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Re: Crystal Meth

Post by Spoops » Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:42 pm

Chaos wrote: However, I'd rather just focus on adjusting all AoEs in general over just throttling one of them, Crystal Rose or otherwise.

I think this is a good idea that could be expanded on with an item, maybe a torso slot or glove slot item (like a shield) that reduces AoE damage taken, crystal rose would still need Blazing and Swift augments touched upon I think though.

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Re: Crystal Meth

Post by Raigen.Convict » Tue Feb 27, 2018 3:30 pm

As someone who experienced both Blazing and Swift Crystal roses best and worst moments, I agree Crystal Rose as a base is necessary almost for duelists to succeed in certain scenarios. While Swift Crystal Rose gets out of hand with the critical damage. As was suggested earlier, halving the cinder damage on blazing so it's not overbearing but still can be used to create a mine-field of cinder tiles is fine, and Swift... I guess halving the crit damage? Not sure how to fix lightning crits.
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