Durability

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Spoops
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Durability

Postby Spoops » Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:09 am

Durability doesn't have a large enough impact for some builds, its important for things like Eviter and blade barrier, but really only ever eviter and blade barrier.

This allows even basic attack heavy attackers like duelist to get away with some enchants like Rustic and some weapon mods like Razor Blade with little lasting impact on their weapon. (Never seen a Hisen user ever have trouble with durability, despite its low low rate.)

Here's what I think, basic attack skills such as Hanging, Sidecut, Power Grad etc. should all use 1 durability when used, Maybe this'd cause some people who actually worry about it for once, especially when choosing their enchantments now that Divine Eye is so accessible.


The reason as to why only basic attacks is because basics usually have far better rewards than autohits, not only boasting momentum gained on crit which is further amplified by duelist, but also regenning FP with Chivalry and battle spirits, and doing additional damage with critical hit checks.

Its a heavy shift, but one that might be worthwhile for overall duelist and arbalest/ranger balance, I'd like some thoughts shared, and/or concerns.

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Re: Durability

Postby Lolzytripd » Wed Feb 28, 2018 4:58 am

So long as wild ride doesn't waste even more durability per use, it chews through 5-6 durability per use.

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Re: Durability

Postby Spoops » Wed Feb 28, 2018 5:55 am

I think you're thinking of Lead Storm.

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Re: Durability

Postby Fern » Wed Feb 28, 2018 6:54 am

The reason no one runs out of durability with Hisen is because they almost always make it Divine. Just for the record.

I'm personally indifferent for the most part, but my only concern is how this plays against builds with enormous tanking/healing. We've got people bragging about how they got someone's weapon to break by just tanking it up, and in some cases using Thousand Stab to delete durability. Although the most common offender is Priest-walling.
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Re: Durability

Postby Spoops » Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:29 pm

I think about only 50% of people I've seen make Hisen divine and thats because it goes well with destiny duelist when it is, otherwise vorpal and especially holy seem to be popular as well.

As for current issues, there are many ways to get past it even if the durability thing was introduced, for example bringing along autohits and magic, both Ghost and Kensei have easy access to these, as for purposefully breaking someone's weapon with skills like thousand stab, it sounds like a sound tactic to me, what not with durability control (Weapon Discipline and Relilability.) it takes a long time to wittle a weapon down, and even at that you can simply toggle Eviter off.

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Re: Durability

Postby Shujin » Wed Feb 28, 2018 5:08 pm

I don't know I am also most indifferent towards it, but I feel if we go this path I would let outhits consume them aswell.

simply so rustic SWA stackers and stuff have als a downside and have to use repair more often. They get our lovely 5% resist all doll afterall.
While basic attacks often rewards with crits some of the Autohits can be superior with damage stacking meta (cause addtional multiplier, with lightning that also gets crit.)

So yeah I don't know, I don't think it's needed. Durabillity is a pain in the ass for our newbies already.

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Re: Durability

Postby Spoops » Wed Feb 28, 2018 5:59 pm

Making autohits consume durability would make both autohits and rustic pretty trash, autohits already have to go vs evasion which already cuts your hit slightly, and aren't supposed to scale as hard as basics either, nor do do they have benefits like: On-hit damage, FP on hit, Vampirism and many other unique weapon effects.

And it'd make it so that a build that relies too heavily on basics is just as out of place as a build that relies on too many autohits.

Durability managment is something newbies can learn to deal with, they'll quickly see ways to mitigate durability loss if they look at Maintenance talents and skills like Weapon Discipline, not to mention it'd actually make weapon repair kits worth selling again for our many alchemists.

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Shujin
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Re: Durability

Postby Shujin » Wed Feb 28, 2018 8:08 pm

Honestly I think it sucks that someone with a rustic tome can just cast out infinite spells, with no down side. Anyway I guess that an opinion thing, I don't think it's really needed. And if I would find it fair if both sides get the hit, you still use the stuff so it's only logical. Again just my two cents.

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Re: Durability

Postby Fern » Wed Feb 28, 2018 9:02 pm

Spoops wrote:I think about only 50% of people I've seen make Hisen divine and thats because it goes well with destiny duelist

As for current issues, there are many ways to get past it even if the durability thing was introduced, for example bringing along autohits and magic, both Ghost and Kensei have easy access to these


They actually make it Divine because they want to Blade Barrier with it, in most of the cases, when running a set up such as Kensei/BK with Bloody Palms and a Swordmaster's Ring. Some of them consider it for Eviter too - but mainly the gun deflection.

My concern still stands. In practice, Duelist Classes autohits are feeble against massive healing, they're usually better off basic attacking and even then their weapon breaks occasionally.

It's because a 100 damage Crystal Rose / Ghostwind won't outrace 250+ Graft healing per round. Theorycrafting is unfortunately not always as good as it seems, practice can show a whole other world.

Thousand Stab being used for weapon breaking is a fair strategy, yes... but other than that, I share a similar opinion as Shujin here - I don't really feel it's needed but I wouldn't mind if it was in, sans the particular case of healing abuse I mentioned earlier.
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Re: Durability

Postby Snake » Fri Mar 02, 2018 9:09 pm

Stuff like Hanging and Sidecut really need to consume durability. While others like Crystal Rose and Kagekiri shouldn't.

I don't even know why they don't at the moment, anyway. We have a passive in Soldier made to gib down this by like half to all weapons, which is also very well accessible to newbies. Aside the fact that durability-chewing is still going to be cut down by the Sword Proficiency talent. Add this to that and BAM! 1 durability is reduced to 0.25.

Besides, at the counter arguments, if Durability was really something to shrug off, we would best try to put up a thread to remove it so it saves code space for Dev to work on, mm? Spo is just pointing out one of the game mechanics that Dev adds then forgets/puts on low priority to finish. Like Ill Will. RIP that.

+1 to this thread.
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