Diving Criticism

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Yark
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Diving Criticism

Postby Yark » Wed Aug 15, 2018 12:39 pm

In slight contrast to my recent thread praising increased BDP level and difficulty, I wanted to raise a few criticisms about diving and offer some ideas to improve it.

First, the good:
  • It offers a way to use stamina aside from crafting.
  • It gives more value to the Stamina talent.
  • It encourages more people to participate in the fishing contests.

Now the bad:
  • It has completely devalued most 7* weapons in the game.
  • The scope of rewards seems to be small.
  • It is not engaging in any way; just click a lot.


Regarding the first and second "bad" aspects to diving, my recommendation is to expand the items which can be found in chests. I think the spawn rate for chests is fine, but from my experience you're almost guaranteed to get a 7* weapon or accessory when you open it. Expand the rarity range for weapons and accessories found in chests, maybe from 3* all the way up to 10*, with drop rate decreasing as rarity increases. And to be clear, I'm talking about maybe a 1/1000 chance of getting a 10* item. The point of this suggestion is not to snag more rare items for myself; rather, it is to return value to 7* items by making them appropriately rare, and to be a carrot on a stick for those who are currently uninterested in diving.

"Why would I use the new diving feature? I don't want any stupid katanas."

Versus....

"Wow, you can get 9* and 10* items from diving now? I'm gonna do that every time my stamina regenerates!"

Now the issue of it not being engaging. There's really not much I can think of here aside from maybe the addition of different types of chests. For example, maybe a special kind of chest can spawn which must have its lock picked to open, similar to chests in the overworld. And for those who do not take the lockpicking talent, maybe an additional type of rusty chest may spawn that cannot be opened, but must be smashed; players with decent STR can do this. These special chests could contain items just like the normal chests, but also a small amount of murai and/or sea tokens.

Maybe add some additional random rewards from kelp based on your level of the Gatherer talent, and additional rewards from bones based on your level of the Miner talent. Could even do the same for coral based on the Scavenger talent? Not really sure, and this particular portion of the suggestion is not hugely important. Might just be worth considering.

And one very last quick note on the sea token shop. For the most part, I think it has some pretty good items on offer - particularly the enchants, the diving helmet and the treasure map. But here are a few ideas for other items you could add.

- An anchor (accessory) which grants immunity to knockback, similar to Spiked Treads.
- A seaman's telescope (accessory), which reveals statistics similar to Setsuna.
- A bottle of ancient rum (accessory) which increases evasion but induces poison.

I'm sure the community can think of many more of these, but the effects of the current weapons are... only decent, and very situational.

Thoughts?
Last edited by Yark on Wed Aug 15, 2018 5:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Raigen.Convict
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Re: Diving Criticism

Postby Raigen.Convict » Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:53 pm

10/10 well done. I want all of these.
OOC Devourer Of Souls: it makes me feel like someone slipped me acid laced water

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Shujin
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Re: Diving Criticism

Postby Shujin » Wed Aug 15, 2018 4:51 pm

What I would like to see in future for diving would be:
1.)Different Watertiles associated to different locations are different from Dormehos or Celssvich. Making other things be findable in the water. Actually kinda want that for fishing aswell, other ponds giving chance for other fish that we do not have yet.

2.)
A new icon you can click that offers Random Events. Random Events can be good or bad. To make those things more interactive there could be a game of choice played. What I am thinking of is something many point and click adventures do for example:
Random Event: You see a shark in the distance!
Choice 1: Swim away! (Either RNG chance based on Cel/luc to escape or simply cost additional Stamina)
Choice 2: Sharks are harmless! Ignore it! (Chance that you get attacked and get a random wound from moderate or higher. Also I think you shouldn't be able to dive with an untreated wound)
Choice 3: hunt the shark! (either there could be a string of choices that describe the "Fight", and RNG chance based on I do not even know what and if you fail you get wounded and if you manage you get some Shark meat/shark teeth/shark fin which can probably be cooked and crafted.)

Or something like:
Random Event: You found a little cave along the shelf!
Choice 1: Explore it! (costs 10 Stamina a few fluff windows with choices that keep going aslong as you have stamina or get a negative, There can either be nothing, more negative things, or something like a better chest with bigger rewards)
Choice 2: Ignore it!

Something along those lines would be pretty cool, and more interactive since you play your classical adventure games basically. There could even be Events like finding a sunken pirate ship, which actually ends up in real combat. Or if we follow with my 1.) certain regions could have Water Monsters inside their water which you could actively hunt, depending on how dangerous their waters are.

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Spoops
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Re: Diving Criticism

Postby Spoops » Wed Aug 15, 2018 6:09 pm

I think increasing the chances of getting 8* and 9* which is what the chest encompasses along with the 7* pool would completely devalue 9* weapons or armor as a whole, thats just my thoughts.

Yark
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Re: Diving Criticism

Postby Yark » Wed Aug 15, 2018 7:10 pm

Spoops wrote:I think increasing the chances of getting 8* and 9* which is what the chest encompasses along with the 7* pool would completely devalue 9* weapons or armor as a whole, thats just my thoughts.

Yark wrote:from 3* all the way up to 10*, with drop rate decreasing as rarity increases.

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Spoops
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Re: Diving Criticism

Postby Spoops » Wed Aug 15, 2018 7:28 pm

Yark wrote:
Spoops wrote:I think increasing the chances of getting 8* and 9* which is what the chest encompasses along with the 7* pool would completely devalue 9* weapons or armor as a whole, thats just my thoughts.

Yark wrote:from 3* all the way up to 10*, with drop rate decreasing as rarity increases.


Why would you do that, thats giving it the regular chest drop pool which you can get by going into any dungeon, at least with this chest pool you're more likely to get an 8* or 9* in these chests than any other.

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Re: Diving Criticism

Postby Yark » Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:22 pm

Spoops wrote:
Yark wrote:
Spoops wrote:I think increasing the chances of getting 8* and 9* which is what the chest encompasses along with the 7* pool would completely devalue 9* weapons or armor as a whole, thats just my thoughts.

Yark wrote:from 3* all the way up to 10*, with drop rate decreasing as rarity increases.


Why would you do that, thats giving it the regular chest drop pool which you can get by going into any dungeon, at least with this chest pool you're more likely to get an 8* or 9* in these chests than any other.

Because using a diving mask takes zero effort or engagement with game mechanics. The tables don't have to be the same as dungeon chests, but currently because of diving chests, 7* weapons don't have any value. This should not be the case.

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Killah-K12
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Re: Diving Criticism

Postby Killah-K12 » Thu Aug 16, 2018 6:25 pm

My solution to the whole of diving may or may not be alot simpler. My solution is add a some more seven stars into it and make the certain Items(5-7 stars specifcally) region specific. Like you have a better chance of finding one of the katana's in the oceans of oniga then if you were to go to dormeho to look for them just as you are much more likely to find a say a detective trench coat or fake badge in Kysei or the empire as supposed to lordwain. Add some new items in the three to seven star list and make the higher level ones have better rates in regions of their homeland.

I'm also in total agreement with the diving being a lot more interactive.


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