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+--- Thread: Books2OP (/showthread.php?tid=2094)
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Books2OP - Rendar - 12-20-2015
Booksmack needs a nerf. Now, I know what you're saying "but salt!"
Nah. We were testing some stuff, and the fact that Booksmack is in play is ridiculous. It's basically Knockdown, but completely shreds your momentum without impunity. "Well it costs 4 momentum!" If you go before your opponent, and have a decent enough hit with one, you can and will land hits of it. Any skill/effect that reduces your momentum is much stronger than it 'seems'. It makes you lose 2 M, does damage, can crit ((which can negate the downsides of 4 M)). AND...
It can be paired up with Knockdown. What does that mean? Every other round, you can make someone lose 5M, or every down someone you fight will lose 5M if they don't have on guard. Which means they can do NOTHING except for small things like sharpen, maybe bash (if they're a lucky duck and are DH which is still a ridiculously good class).
So, a suggestion I guess?
Having Booksmack just apply "Knockdown" would be the simplest thing, meaning it can't stack with itself, but that also comes with its own issues of "man now everyone with a mainhand tome can just KD"
So maybe just having it so that if a person is knocked down, they don't lose any momentum from being 'book smacked'. or have Booksmack start triggering "On Guard" and giving momentum for it so that someone with a tome can't just run up to someone, book smack them, then force them to fight in "you lose 2M and get to attack me, or you run away and I chase, then smack you again." It's kind of ridiculous.
Re: Books2OP - Fern - 12-20-2015
I was in the test, yeah. I can just book smack > overload invocation cast with lazarus wind and stop people from fighting back. Specially if they have no On Guard.
I think it can just lower momentum by 1 instead of 2, though.
Re: Books2OP - Soapy - 12-20-2015
"[url=http://neus-projects.net/viewtopic.php?p=10828#p10828 Wrote:Fern » Sat Dec 19, 2015 7:05 pm[/url]"]I think it can just lower momentum by 1 instead of 2, though.I'm pretty sure I suggested this at some point.
Re: Books2OP - MegaBlues - 12-20-2015
It only works -if- you're faster, -if- you're in one range as a Mage, and -if- you manage to connect with a heavy-ass tome, with no weapon modifications, or passives to increase hit.
I think this is fine as-is.
Re: Books2OP - Soapy - 12-20-2015
I'm also pretty sure I suggested making it work if you're slower.
Re: Books2OP - Rendar - 12-20-2015
"[url=http://neus-projects.net/viewtopic.php?p=10830#p10830 Wrote:MegaBlues » Sat Dec 19, 2015 7:17 pm[/url]"]It only works -if- you're faster, -if- you're in one range as a Mage, and -if- you manage to connect with a heavy-ass tome, with no weapon modifications, or passives to increase hit.
I think this is fine as-is.
Okay but. A tactician using it. Who's also a monk. Dense Thunder, Tome Smack. If they have good STR and SKI, they can forgo most of the WIL downsides because you can use your SKI in place of damage. Or, it doesn't even matter if you can simply just stun-lock someone because you will, eventually, kill them.
Re: Books2OP - Autumn - 12-20-2015
I've always had a problem with booksmack as it gives mages even more options against tanks in general, I'll agree that it should be lowered down to 1m no matter how much momentum the victim has.
Re: Books2OP - Chaos - 12-20-2015
"[url=http://www.neus-projects.net/viewtopic.php?p=10830#p10830 Wrote:MegaBlues » Sat Dec 19, 2015 8:17 pm[/url]"]It only works -if- you're faster, -if- you're in one range as a Mage, and -if- you manage to connect with a heavy-ass tome, with no weapon modifications, or passives to increase hit.This mostly spells out my thoughts on the matter. There are also very few options that enable the user to land the Tome Special Attack and inflict Knockdown in the same turn, and anyone with Kip Up or 25%+ Blunt Resistance will make the combo pointless. This is a party trick at best.
I think this is fine as-is.
Re: Books2OP - Zakizo - 12-20-2015
I also think that it's fine as-is. If anything knockdown is the problem, considering it takes more momentum, and in some skills it auto-hits. Book Smack won't work on everyone considering you have to hit with it, what Chaos said, you have to fight within 1 range to do it, and then we toss in Riposte and other possible counters like things that inflict damage on attack. I'm thinking maybe the BK skill that cancels on hit effects should be made to nullify this if it doesn't already, but I don't see Book Smack itself as a problem. And someone who doesn't have On Guard..? You're joking, right?
Re: Books2OP - Fern - 12-20-2015
People that don't have On Guard exist yes. Just like Felidaes with Blind Fighting.
As far as I know you can't Riposte book smack because it's a projectile.
You can just inflict whatever source of knock down you have before book smacking if it's not blunt damage. Against blunt resistance.
Building up for being accurate with a tome just so you can smack them with it in 1 range isn't hard. /stares at Soapy.