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+--- Thread: Rany's Lowbie Corner: Goblin Giants (/showthread.php?tid=3800)
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Rany's Lowbie Corner: Goblin Giants - Ranylyn - 12-05-2016
I just fought a level 10 Goblin Giant with 450 HP.
Level 10.
450 HP.
I think we may have another case of the old Jammer Omega 270% Vit Growth on our hands. Probably should be toned down; even my level 7 Chun was only doing 50-ish per hit, and was defeated on the second hit it took (Well, 3rd, due to rampage, I guess.) My character was downright tanky for their level (+8 Defense on a starting breastplate and 13 Def/18 Vit and was also dunked on the 3rd hit (4th due to rampage, technically) That much power + that much HP = Dev what.
I'm sure they're fine later on, but... that was silly.
Re: Rany's Lowbie Corner: Goblin Giants - Snake - 12-05-2016
Me and Sderg have been through this already. Even as two low-level Hexers spamming WO, we couldn't beat a level 10-15 boss because he had like 600+ HP, while our maximum damage was like 70, with heavy FP costs. (I don't remember much about that one, but yeah, something like that wrecked us real good, it was funny, not fun.)
There's no trick there, you're deemed to get gibbed apart without the help from another player with a higher level. :/
Re: Rany's Lowbie Corner: Goblin Giants - Exxy - 12-05-2016
While you can typically get away with most early mobs if you invest some into Vit and another means of Defense we could probably adjust the formula for bosses under Level 30-35 (since by then you should be part-way into your new Promo Vocation and possibly have team mates either on-par with you or in end-game to help).
If we could get an idea of what the current formula is based on from Neus it'd help figuring out a way to adjust it for beginning lowbies to have more of a chance without getting a complete hand-out.
EDIT: Even if it's just something staggered like this (graph not to scale - it implies dropping the lower half of the spectrum by x amount of HP before hitting 30+):
![[Image: b56856f378ac4f339ea75e336197d6ba.png]](http://image.prntscr.com/image/b56856f378ac4f339ea75e336197d6ba.png)
Re: Rany's Lowbie Corner: Goblin Giants - Rendar - 12-05-2016
Kunai and I went up against a level 10(ish) dungeon at level 8 or so. Both of us hexers. I was a vamp. We got facerolled by a guy that shot 3ish times for 50 damage each shot.
Dungeon bosses, at lower levels, are just impossible to fight.
Re: Rany's Lowbie Corner: Goblin Giants - Neus - 12-06-2016
Screenshot of stats? I could see adjusting HP down slightly, and maybe give them a slightly weaker attack weapon at low levels.
Re: Rany's Lowbie Corner: Goblin Giants - Ranylyn - 12-06-2016
I'll take screenshots next time I encounter low level bosses. All I know is that Roughly 20 Def + 15 Armor = taking 60+ is way too much at level 10.
Re: Rany's Lowbie Corner: Goblin Giants - Ranylyn - 12-06-2016
I just killed a level 9 Alraune. It was 100% reasonable.
- It's damage output wasn't 60+ per hit. (I was taking 15 with a slightly higher character; 26 Def and 15 armor. So maybe roughly 36 damage for an average level 9? Seems reasonable for a boss.)
- Lack of Rampage means kiting it to avoid it's charm is reasonable.
- It had HP comparable to the Omega Jammer and Kinu 1
It's definitely not all lowbie bosses. Just some especially eggregious ones, it seems.
Re: Rany's Lowbie Corner: Goblin Giants - Neus - 12-10-2016
That's good. So which bosses aren't reasonable and should get a bit of an adjustment at lower levels, and what kind of adjustment would be best? I already mentioned it's possible to give them a weapon with less scaling at lower levels, but there might be other things that are necessary.
Re: Rany's Lowbie Corner: Goblin Giants - Ranylyn - 12-10-2016
I don't have any recent screenshots of stats, but here's a few I've encountered problems with more recently:
- Kinu 1: MOSTLY FAIR. Except for the fact that her charged Chaser is no longer consumed if no target is in a line. Kinu can move to you, attack, and THEN chaser on her next turn. This leads to a lot of hit and run to avoid taking 80-90 damage on characters with 120-150 max HP, and opens you up to hellhound hariga.
- Goblin Giant: Reasons listed in the original post: The combination of way too much HP and way too much damage for that level is... OW? And kiting it isn't an option either, because Rampage.
- Winged Guardian: I think most of the other story bosses are more than reasonable for being tackled at their respective levels (10-ish for Kinu 1, 35-ish for Kinu 2, etc, although don't quote me on this since I don't think I've done Ashe Post-GR) but for a level 20 boss, Winged Guardian's 1000 HP and the sheer power behind Raven (I recently tried to fight it with a level 31 with 300 HP, 13 res, and 10 Magic Armor, and was still taking 70+ damage and was downed on turn 4) is a little crazy. Even Pre-GR, it was the one story boss that wasn't entirely reasonable to tackle at it's own level (I've MANAGED to squeak out a victory as low as level 17, but that involved using a wall of dead mercs to box it in as I wore it down with crystal rose spam.) Speaking of autohit spam, Raven also causes blind, making it hell for a melee character of the Human/Mechanation/Corrupted variety, who don't want buttloads of San for status resist since it offers them very little else/ actively penalizes them in the case of corrupted.
Gigas Rex: This one is hilarious. High stats in exchange for being so simplistic seems fine on paper, but then you consider the truth: If you have access to seeker flame or Butterfly Illusions, it can't even touch you. EVER. I've soloed a level 20 one at level 5 with Seeker Flame/Zeroaid attacks, since it was losing M upon attacking the flame and couldn't reach me. Yet on the complete flipside, if you don't have ways to cheese it, it's very possible you'll just get flat out dunked due to the stats, unless you have high evade or are running a set with incredible DR (I had a character with absurd DR, a max San Naga BK, Hanging + Coil with softcapped def... still taking over 40 per hit from a same-level Rex, before. I'm sorry, WHAT!?)
Re: Rany's Lowbie Corner: Goblin Giants - Ranylyn - 01-04-2017
Dev, we've got a new offender.
https://i.gyazo.com/3a78ba9d502e964ccbd63bd93ad8459b.png
Fangs attacks [Redacted] with Super Sandfang and hits them!
[Redacted] takes 80 Pierce physical damage.
(Yes, this was a Maul.)
For the record, the character in question taking that hit was level 24, 5 Armor, 16 defense, 0% Pierce Resist. So fairly fragile still, but seriously.