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+--- Thread: Geist Schritt vs AoEs (/showthread.php?tid=4593)
Geist Schritt vs AoEs - Autumn - 05-30-2017
Geist Schritt (Zwei) seems to be vastly inconsistent when it comes to AoEs, some it blocks while others it does not block, such as Crystal Rose, it will not block Crystal Rose, but it will Block something such as Isendo and Lantern Bearer AoEs, and very recently, now it blocks Wretched Oil too.
Perhaps Geist Schritt (Zwei) should receive the same treatment that Spell Snatch received, both being very similar in what they do, but Geist Schritt serves as a very large momentum shift instead.
So here's what I propose, similar to Spell Snatch, Geist Schritt (Zwei) should not block AoE attacks anymore, both to keep it consistent, and not make Geist Schritt (Zwei) the end all be all GS Skill.
Re: Geist Schritt vs AoEs - Snake - 05-30-2017
We can even be lazy here and say that Geist Schritt should just not trigger against spells in general, most of the problems come when it stops targeting skills, as it is supposed to be.
And besides, Boxers have a way to silence the enemy, so it won't be much of a problem for them and just to make it a little more fair against mages, which seems to be the only big problem from my own observation.
Re: Geist Schritt vs AoEs - Neus - 05-31-2017
It may behave different versus some AoEs because many of them target a location of tiles instead of enemies. Any inconsistencies you are experiencing are likely due to that. For example with Crystal Rose, if you look at the skill in the skill board, it'll say it targets a location.
Re: Geist Schritt vs AoEs - Autumn - 05-31-2017
Chaser and Sidecut also ignore Geist Schritt, but they don't exactly target locations, I think that having Geist Schritt (Zwei) be ignored by AoEs would be a lot easier for most folk to handle, Boxer still can turn any fight they want to with only 1 proc of this skill, and Geist Schritt(Zwei) is used almost 90% of the time anyways, because its clearly the best version of Geist Schritt.
Spell Snatch is not often complained about, but Geist Schritt is, mostly because Spell Snatch has work arounds to it, but still has enough power to make it impactful.
Re: Geist Schritt vs AoEs - Stenzio - 06-03-2017
There is a difference between Geist and Spell Snatch in this regard however. Unlike Spell Snatch, Geist is integral to Boxer. Most, when faced with one, already just spam AoE's just to deal with them.
Even in terms of spells, a good portion of Evoker spells bypass it already. Sear, Windslasher, Isenshi, Vydel, and Libregrande (the five also being prominent elements the majority of people in-game use); and in terms of mage spells: Air Pressure, Fir, Explosion, Famuiga and Mui (I think), and Stone Dragon (would have included Isendo but I -think- it triggers it?). While there could be more exceptions, since it does in retrospec screw over Lightning users. But with the multitude of options that seem to exist already? Being so secluded as to use one element (albeit even for IC reason) can have that issue of being unable to deal with such threats.
The point being options, even in magic, exist to deal with it. Even melee users opt to use Sidecut, Silcut, Crystal Rose, Cyclone Spear, Chaser, etcetera instead of take the chance to proc it. We have to take in mind that literally the Geists are the only thing that allow a Boxer to not be completely cheesed; since most will position themselves in a place a Boxer would need to Orkham them just to get into their other offensive skills. It acts as a way to help them have a chance to keep close and in position without being rendered useless.
TL;DR: Please just keep it how it is. Their Geist is literally one of the few things keeping them from being about as cheesed as a character that gets immobilized without any sort of 'teleport' skills/spells (I.E: Blink)
Re: Geist Schritt vs AoEs - MegaBlues - 06-03-2017
The problem with Geist isn't the movement, it's the negation. It's currently the best set of tanking skills the game has, and people can use Boxer solely for defense.
People have cried about Dodge and Evasion being too strong because they used to offer too much negation, and Geist is worse. If you use autohits, you spam the one you can use without being negated, if you can. If you rely on basic attacks, you're SOL. And if you play the guessing game, they may get to negate your attack, move in, and ramp up their damage for free. Even if they fail, they've still closed the gap slightly.
I suggest turning the negation into 40% DR, halved if boxer isn't main class. I also suggest compiling a list of AoEs that Geist shouldn't affect.
Re: Geist Schritt vs AoEs - Autumn - 06-03-2017
"MegaBlues" Wrote:The problem with Geist isn't the movement, it's the negation. It's currently the best set of tanking skills the game has, and people can use Boxer solely for defense.Damage negation into momentum gain for doing so is incredibly strong, I agree, and while Geist Schritt should have been a heavy damage reduction, something around 50% 60%, I think with that sort of option it wouldn't be fair to give it the whole 'ignored by AoEs' treatment too, that being said, its a little late to change it up now.
People have cried about Dodge and Evasion being too strong because they used to offer too much negation, and Geist is worse. If you use autohits, you spam the one you can use without being negated, if you can. If you rely on basic attacks, you're SOL. And if you play the guessing game, they may get to negate your attack, move in, and ramp up their damage for free. Even if they fail, they've still closed the gap slightly.
I suggest turning the negation into 40% DR, halved if boxer isn't main class. I also suggest compiling a list of AoEs that Geist shouldn't affect.
Quote:There is a difference between Geist and Spell Snatch in this regard however. Unlike Spell Snatch, Geist is integral to Boxer. Most, when faced with one, already just spam AoE's just to deal with them.
Spell Snatch and its sister Snatch Spell are both core to Spellthief, for those who wish to play Spellthief like an actual anti mage of course, and not those just looking for the utility of grabbing 5 spells and being an all rounder.
The trade off for when faced with AoEs is that AoEs tend to do less damage than single target abilities.