The Issues with Glancing Blows / Full Evasion - Printable Version +- NEUS Projects (https://neus-projects.net/forums) +-- Forum: Sigrogana Legend 2 (OOC) (https://neus-projects.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=8) +--- Forum: Balance Fu (https://neus-projects.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=11) +--- Thread: The Issues with Glancing Blows / Full Evasion (/showthread.php?tid=8572) |
The Issues with Glancing Blows / Full Evasion - Miller - 10-18-2021 I'm not going to lie, this system has way too many issues to be fun to play in, even as someone who enjoys playing heavy CEL investment characters 90% of the time. So I'm going to address the major individual points of why this system is so frustrating to deal with on both sides. FULL EVASION IS POLARIZING GLANCING BLOWS ODDS GLANCING BLOWS AVOIDING INFLICTS SKILL STAT TAX Buffs/Debuffs It's Almost Impossible To Balance Around (Eventmin) RE: The Issues with Glancing Blows / Full Evasion - Lolzytripd - 10-18-2021 Log curved hit ratios or minimum/,maximum hit rates based on 10+scaled skill and 110%-scaled cel. (1/2 scaled cel for heavy torso) Glancing should also be changed to a more forgiving system in hits favor, as suggested before. Making it so that glancing only occurs if the first hit check misses would solve it. With the above change the avoiding inflicts would be fine With the first suggestion the skill tax wouldn't be as lofty, allowing you to go 35-40 points invested in skill instead of the required 55 scaled. For buffs ad debuffs we likely need to just shoot it... only the highest debuff/buff to hit evade counts, no others. Bind should be changed to do something else. I'm not an eventmin, I can't speak for them. RE: The Issues with Glancing Blows / Full Evasion - Jeff - 10-19-2021 I greatly dislike the idea of limiting player-applied buffs and debuffs. It is the system design itself that needs to be addressed, rather than the stats and skills that exacerbate the existing problem. RE: The Issues with Glancing Blows / Full Evasion - Sawrock - 10-19-2021 Any system that has stacking buffs heavily favors magic-heavy tropes; why wouldn’t you use magic if it’s another thing you add on? From shield spells in tabletop RPGs being better than using a shield alone to having spellthief hold every buff spell under the sun, it greatly limits character concept. To be the best you need to be more efficient. The same can not be as widely said about magic users using nonmagical means- they aren’t compromising their identity, but are instead clever. Having a thieving sorcerer that can pick pockets doesn’t make him less of a sorcerer, but a magic-using warrior is to the likes of Elric of Melniboné rather than Conan the Barbarian. If you can only apply the highest buff, it’s still a momentum saver- let’s say you buff your friend. Now he can attack twice instead of wasting a turn on a buff. RE: The Issues with Glancing Blows / Full Evasion - Poruku - 10-23-2021 A good summary of why glancing is so limiting. I find myself cramming hit into builds in ways I wish I didn't need to. As someone who loves pvp, I enjoyed the shakeup but as the novelty wears off and I'm trying to make new and interesting builds, I just find the decision making not as enjoyable. For a lot of combos I wish I could make, like a character using evokes for instance, the only real choice is to either make the character more solid and take the L against evasion, or go for a way to actually win against evasion at any cost (like going runemage subclass just cause +60 hit for 4 momentum). Some builds are naturally fine, like firebird anything or bk or explosion mage or engineer with bombs, etc. But what this update did is make the distinction between a good build and a bad one much more drastic, and difficult matchups (in terms of evasion) less enjoyable RE: The Issues with Glancing Blows / Full Evasion - Kazzy - 10-25-2021 Crazy idea time. Remove hit and dodge bonuses from classes/enchantments. This way it is raw stat V stat. BUT HERE IS WHERE IT GETS CRAZY. Give people buttons to say 'My next ability hits' or 'I dodge the next ability'. So people still have the ability to pay resource to guarantee their strike lands. Or, if you see that big chonkin' evoke coming- you can dodge it. 'But Kaz,' , I hear you say. 'Where's the counterplay?' COOLDOWNS. Give these bad boys a 3-5 round cooldown and make part of the experience a fighting game mentality of faking out your opponent into popping their CD early. Someone charging an evoke can skip to make the Perfect Dodge™ wear off. Make Perfect Dodge and Perfect Strike™ nullify one another and bring things back to sheer chance. This keeps people from having Glancing Woes, it keeps people from having to splash classes that don't match their IC simply to have enough stats to compete in the big boy games, and it keeps us from having to go into every class that doesnt have a hit/evade buff and go 'Okay now you have to spend points on these instead of what you actually want to use so you can actually participate.' Someone could probably expand on this idea more than I can. But this is 100% the result of a fever and too much time reading old ttrpgs. |