[Kameron8]

Currently, Magic Gunners who use multi-round weapons suffer from a very severe issue. They either fight against enemies who possess one of their many hard counters, or they don't. That alone dictates who wins a fight. It is essentially impossible for multihit guns to compete against Know No Pain, Fang Faced Shield, Bellplate, Cobra/Watchful Eye + Blade Barrier, or Enchant Shield. Having one of these listed skills or items makes you all but immune to the gunner, because they kill themselves faster than they kill you.

On the flip side, if you do NOT possess any of these items, and you don't have the dodge to avoid the bullets, you have essentially lost the fight already. Multihit guns can pump out anywhere from 150-650 damage in 7 momentum with no setup, which is almost unheard of in any other circumstance. There needs to be a decent middle ground here, because there is next to no tweaks that a gunner can make to NOT instantly die to those counters, and stacking defense obviously does nothing against guns.

[Rendar]

Multi-hit gunners are still better than single-shot gunners.

With Single Shot gunners being actually stopped in their tracks by Cobra+Watchful eye (or bladebarrier), Spirit Mirror (ESPECIALLY if they have an auto-charging gun) or a few other things i can't think of right now.

[Fern]

Rendar » Fri Dec 11, 2015 1:11 pm[/url]"]Multi-hit gunners are still better than single-shot gunners.

No, they're not. Multi-shot gunners have many more counters compared to single-shot gunners. It isn't very hard for an auto-charge sniper user to wait until they hit LV1 charge and 'ruin' themselves with 70 damage while still being able to inflict an Overcharge status effect on their Spirit Mirror'd enemy and win the fight easily after.

A single-shot gunner is capable of ruining almost literally everything and losing 4 out of 22 battles.
A multi-shot gunner is much better when it comes to killing yourself.

And most PVP addicts can easily see those differences by just playing both versions.

[Rendar]

I wasn't diminishing how killself.exe works. I was meaning that more in the fact that they still murder the SHIT out of themself, both of them.

Multi-hit gunners do it better, but they get around the bads that single-shot gunners get around and vice versa.

You have Fellel's fumble? Multi-shot it away.

You have spirit Mirror? Multi Shot it away.

They have Bell/a shitton of other stuff? Single-shot.

Honestly, having an automatic weapon that can swap (with a toggle) between single shot and multi-shot would be kinda handy. brb suggesting that