10-25-2020, 11:45 PM
Hey guys. I know I'm not around very often, but I do tend to poke around the forums/Discord and see what is going on. I've noticed that it has been a rather popular topic to address the state of the game when it comes to RP. Since we're in the process of addressing some of the common issues that I think we've all noticed with SL2 at some point in time, I would like to take the time to point out some things that I've noticed regarding the mapping.
I'm not here to bash anyone's mapping, cause effort goes into everyone's work. I think we all can agree that we hold appreciation for anyone who is willing to put their work on display for everyone to enjoy. I'm not expecting for everyone to chime in on this only due to not everyone being knowledgeable in this field, but chiming in to get a conversation going is always good enough. I apologize for any added stress onto anyone by speaking on this topic at this time. Anyways, time to begin.
Tileset(s):
This is probably the most noticeable issue when it comes to the game's design. Whether you're a new player or an old player I'm sure you have all realized this at some point. Simply put, there are too many different tilesets. What do I mean by that? I'm not speaking of tilesets that cover each environment / biome, I'm speaking of that there are too many tilesets that are clearly made by different authors. Going from the "Default" Cellsvich tileset to the Shrine tileset, Oniga to Lispool. You can just clearly tell that they do not fit in with one another.
Solution?
It is most likely impossible to fix with SL2 due to how many maps are actually made with the game (Unless everything is remapped...). The game desperately needs a tileset pixel artist. I know there are some talented individuals who play this game who have the ability to make a tileset, though it would be very time consuming. If you look at Cuddlefish's game, Secrets of Grindea, it includes multiple different biomes but you could tell that everything was made by one person OR a group of people who was able to do the job in a similar way. It would definitely make the game look more polished if everything was more uniform and possible would attract more players who keep an eye out for detail.
Map Editor:
Probably the most obvious issue on the subject of mapping. I feel like this is one of the main reason why people usually give up on mapping for this game. It's a struggle trying to get what you're wanting out of it. Of course there is no one to blame for this one. The Dev has already given us the best possible way for us to map the game. The editor however is just a little clunky and hard to maneuver around for anyone new to it. It is very time consuming to get use to and to use it to the fullest of it's extent. It is not very user friendly. It's honestly a turn off knowing that I'm going to have to struggle using this program to map something.
Solution?
This one is honestly just a shot in the dark and most likely impossible. We either need a more user friendly editor or a way to convert maps from another tileset editor to Byond. Small maps aren't so bad to deal with in the editor, but the larger maps.... hah...
For comparison, mapping a 100x100 detailed Map on RPGMaker would probably take me 3 days. (Working for 4 hours each day for 3 days)
Making a detailed 100x100 Map on Byond would take me over a month. (Working for 4 hours or more in the span of that month. This mainly comes from browsing through the every tileset to find what I want. Making new tiles and editing tiles on my own. Mind you, I'm not very good at creating or editing tiles)
Miscellaneous Thoughts (Mainly my rants):
Teamwork:
One thing this game desperately needs is a team. It needs a team for all aspects of development. But since this topic is on mapping, I'll only talk about that. I feel like we need to get a group of players who are willing to learn, share ideas, take criticism from one another and able to come to a agreement on how they should map the game. #Mapping topic on Discord isn't really living up to 'a group coming together'. I'm speaking of an actual development team.
Criticism:
This one annoys me the most. This is more of a personal rant. As someone who mapped for this game, I need your help. The other people who mapped this game needs your help. I mean you, the Playerbase. There are people who actually have requests and help by pointing out mistakes and want changes done to something that do not seem right to them. Then there is from what I see as the majority:
Deadlines:
Please.. and I really mean it. PLEASE. We need deadlines. I understand that we have lives and of course we don't want to be mapping non-stop. I'm glad most of the playerbase cares in that they don't want mappers to be worn out but without deadlines, we don't have to release anything.
I am a perfect example of this. Cellsvich Map was done months before I even handed it to the Dev. Arena was done months before Spo took over the project. (Spo did a great job btw <3) I don't play SL2 anymore so it's not a dire need for me to have to get a finished project over to you guys as bad as it sounds. I'll be doing my own personal business and living my life while the map collects dust. I want to treat this as a job as much as possible, getting paid to do it or not, so I'd also like to feel the need that the map needs to be released.
I think this is all I'll include in this post for now. If you creative minds out there also have something you wish to add, or issues that I didn't mention. Or even if you straight up disagree with me, I'd like to hear what you all have to say.
I'm not here to bash anyone's mapping, cause effort goes into everyone's work. I think we all can agree that we hold appreciation for anyone who is willing to put their work on display for everyone to enjoy. I'm not expecting for everyone to chime in on this only due to not everyone being knowledgeable in this field, but chiming in to get a conversation going is always good enough. I apologize for any added stress onto anyone by speaking on this topic at this time. Anyways, time to begin.
Tileset(s):
This is probably the most noticeable issue when it comes to the game's design. Whether you're a new player or an old player I'm sure you have all realized this at some point. Simply put, there are too many different tilesets. What do I mean by that? I'm not speaking of tilesets that cover each environment / biome, I'm speaking of that there are too many tilesets that are clearly made by different authors. Going from the "Default" Cellsvich tileset to the Shrine tileset, Oniga to Lispool. You can just clearly tell that they do not fit in with one another.
Solution?
It is most likely impossible to fix with SL2 due to how many maps are actually made with the game (Unless everything is remapped...). The game desperately needs a tileset pixel artist. I know there are some talented individuals who play this game who have the ability to make a tileset, though it would be very time consuming. If you look at Cuddlefish's game, Secrets of Grindea, it includes multiple different biomes but you could tell that everything was made by one person OR a group of people who was able to do the job in a similar way. It would definitely make the game look more polished if everything was more uniform and possible would attract more players who keep an eye out for detail.
Map Editor:
Probably the most obvious issue on the subject of mapping. I feel like this is one of the main reason why people usually give up on mapping for this game. It's a struggle trying to get what you're wanting out of it. Of course there is no one to blame for this one. The Dev has already given us the best possible way for us to map the game. The editor however is just a little clunky and hard to maneuver around for anyone new to it. It is very time consuming to get use to and to use it to the fullest of it's extent. It is not very user friendly. It's honestly a turn off knowing that I'm going to have to struggle using this program to map something.
Solution?
This one is honestly just a shot in the dark and most likely impossible. We either need a more user friendly editor or a way to convert maps from another tileset editor to Byond. Small maps aren't so bad to deal with in the editor, but the larger maps.... hah...
For comparison, mapping a 100x100 detailed Map on RPGMaker would probably take me 3 days. (Working for 4 hours each day for 3 days)
Making a detailed 100x100 Map on Byond would take me over a month. (Working for 4 hours or more in the span of that month. This mainly comes from browsing through the every tileset to find what I want. Making new tiles and editing tiles on my own. Mind you, I'm not very good at creating or editing tiles)
Miscellaneous Thoughts (Mainly my rants):
Teamwork:
One thing this game desperately needs is a team. It needs a team for all aspects of development. But since this topic is on mapping, I'll only talk about that. I feel like we need to get a group of players who are willing to learn, share ideas, take criticism from one another and able to come to a agreement on how they should map the game. #Mapping topic on Discord isn't really living up to 'a group coming together'. I'm speaking of an actual development team.
Criticism:
This one annoys me the most. This is more of a personal rant. As someone who mapped for this game, I need your help. The other people who mapped this game needs your help. I mean you, the Playerbase. There are people who actually have requests and help by pointing out mistakes and want changes done to something that do not seem right to them. Then there is from what I see as the majority:
- "Looks better than what we have now."
- "Looks good! (No other input included)"
- "Keep up the good work!"
Deadlines:
Please.. and I really mean it. PLEASE. We need deadlines. I understand that we have lives and of course we don't want to be mapping non-stop. I'm glad most of the playerbase cares in that they don't want mappers to be worn out but without deadlines, we don't have to release anything.
I am a perfect example of this. Cellsvich Map was done months before I even handed it to the Dev. Arena was done months before Spo took over the project. (Spo did a great job btw <3) I don't play SL2 anymore so it's not a dire need for me to have to get a finished project over to you guys as bad as it sounds. I'll be doing my own personal business and living my life while the map collects dust. I want to treat this as a job as much as possible, getting paid to do it or not, so I'd also like to feel the need that the map needs to be released.
I think this is all I'll include in this post for now. If you creative minds out there also have something you wish to add, or issues that I didn't mention. Or even if you straight up disagree with me, I'd like to hear what you all have to say.
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