08-31-2021, 06:04 PM
I was a bit concerned about the changes to autohit and evasion mechanics from the get go, but reserved judgement until I'd seen it in action for a while given the sheer amount of moving parts with such a change. You've pretty much summed up my opinions now though, after seeing it in practice a bit.
Hit vs evade is way too polarizing now, it's the worst part of the basic attacker vs evasion stacker matchup from before the rework now forced onto everybody. Evasion is incredibly oppressive, especially to basic attackers less likely to have an evasion ignoring option, while the properly put together hit stacking counter play is just as oppressive to evasion if not more. Whichever side is the loser, it is so very unfun to lose because you can't hit or can't evade after dumping everything into it.
On top of that, in the case of many builds (my own being probably one of the worst offenders in verglas), autohitters neglecting this numbers race entirely are still alive and well due to a small but reliable evasion ignoring toolkit, allowing them to disregard hit entirely and dump stats elsewhere. I would like to add my own two cents on this part especially. Even though some autohit builds are almost unchanged as a result of this and quite well off as things go, they are now incredibly boring to play. Verglas is also a prime example of this, your playstyle against evasion now going from any number of mixed and matched verglas skills from the three styles to rapid kick, ice point guard boosted icicle spear, and one other thing of choice during the frozen debuff that follows. Personally, it has killed my love for the class.
I've seen countless suggestions for how to go about fixing the issues with the new system but personally, I'm of the mind to just revert the main problem causer here in evasion dodging everything.
Scaling changes? Great.
Gun and magic gunner rework? Great.
Toning down hit and evasion buffs and debuffs and capping their stacking? Great. (Although maybe cap debuffs too lmao)
Most of the other small miscellaneous changes? Great.
My suggestion?
The main idea here is that autohits return to being, well...autohits, which removes the issue of evasion counter play being absolutely mandatory, be it through oppressive hit stacking or boring evasion ignore spam. At the same time, evasion maintains a horse in the race against those tanky autohitters that were always on a different level previously, mainly due to tanks' oppressive 60-70% dr being cut down and evasion's being doubled. Evasion's requires a bit less stat investment for similar dr and has the added possibility of dodging inflicts and secondary effects, but it isn't guaranteed dr and has a bit more counter play as well.
Long story short, I think the numbers are in a good spot right now. I think the system they play into is bad, and very annoying and unfun for the loser and often the winner as well. The all or nothing of hit vs evade with full dodge is just a bad time for all involved, and the two roll glancing blow system is just a band aid to this bad time at best. It's still very all or nothing regardless of the two roll system. I would even suggest removing full dodge from basic attacks, but that's another matter entirely that I am not in any position to make any kind of suggestion on, mostly because it becomes a bit hard to differentiate mechanically and thematically from autohits at that point.
Hit vs evade is way too polarizing now, it's the worst part of the basic attacker vs evasion stacker matchup from before the rework now forced onto everybody. Evasion is incredibly oppressive, especially to basic attackers less likely to have an evasion ignoring option, while the properly put together hit stacking counter play is just as oppressive to evasion if not more. Whichever side is the loser, it is so very unfun to lose because you can't hit or can't evade after dumping everything into it.
On top of that, in the case of many builds (my own being probably one of the worst offenders in verglas), autohitters neglecting this numbers race entirely are still alive and well due to a small but reliable evasion ignoring toolkit, allowing them to disregard hit entirely and dump stats elsewhere. I would like to add my own two cents on this part especially. Even though some autohit builds are almost unchanged as a result of this and quite well off as things go, they are now incredibly boring to play. Verglas is also a prime example of this, your playstyle against evasion now going from any number of mixed and matched verglas skills from the three styles to rapid kick, ice point guard boosted icicle spear, and one other thing of choice during the frozen debuff that follows. Personally, it has killed my love for the class.
I've seen countless suggestions for how to go about fixing the issues with the new system but personally, I'm of the mind to just revert the main problem causer here in evasion dodging everything.
Scaling changes? Great.
Gun and magic gunner rework? Great.
Toning down hit and evasion buffs and debuffs and capping their stacking? Great. (Although maybe cap debuffs too lmao)
Most of the other small miscellaneous changes? Great.
My suggestion?
- Most importantly, revert autohits to not being fully dodge-able.
- Maintain the 60% glancing dr.
- Maintain the ability for glancing to dodge inflicts and secondary effects, in some non-guaranteed fashion.
- Remove evasion ignore from most or all skills that newly acquired it.
- Maintain the def and res changes.
- Maintain the luck changes, but give it some sort of boost not relating to hit or evade. This has already been asked for in the current system, and would be even more vital to the basic attack builds that need to invest in it for crit if they're the only ones able to be full dodged again. Maybe even give skill a boost too for the same reason.
The main idea here is that autohits return to being, well...autohits, which removes the issue of evasion counter play being absolutely mandatory, be it through oppressive hit stacking or boring evasion ignore spam. At the same time, evasion maintains a horse in the race against those tanky autohitters that were always on a different level previously, mainly due to tanks' oppressive 60-70% dr being cut down and evasion's being doubled. Evasion's requires a bit less stat investment for similar dr and has the added possibility of dodging inflicts and secondary effects, but it isn't guaranteed dr and has a bit more counter play as well.
Long story short, I think the numbers are in a good spot right now. I think the system they play into is bad, and very annoying and unfun for the loser and often the winner as well. The all or nothing of hit vs evade with full dodge is just a bad time for all involved, and the two roll glancing blow system is just a band aid to this bad time at best. It's still very all or nothing regardless of the two roll system. I would even suggest removing full dodge from basic attacks, but that's another matter entirely that I am not in any position to make any kind of suggestion on, mostly because it becomes a bit hard to differentiate mechanically and thematically from autohits at that point.
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