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Regarding youkai spell costs
#6
I do think most of the ideas mentioned here are good. One thing I'd like to comment on, however:

(09-15-2020, 12:29 PM)HexGirlBestGirl Wrote: I just don't want you people to forget these things exist and what have you. I don't think I have too many FP Problems on my summoners currently in regards to casting evokes equal to value. But I also use Parted Pain, Natural Evoke and Evoke Mastery on them so. Maybe that's got something to do with it. Since most of said summoners don't go over 300 FP.

Don't get me wrong, it's entirely possible to keep summoners from running out of FP while using evoke skills/spells. The problem is that they cost significantly more FP while offering significantly less in terms of effects and damage (assuming a standard setup) compared to other spells, on a class that, in most cases, is expected to either keep losing FP every turn due to maintaining summoning costs, or instead keep using evokes to swap installs. While Evoke Mastery does even it out, Parted Pain only works for the youkai themselves, and the way Natural Evoke works right now normally doesn't help, since Chaos Reflex encourages you to keep switching installs anyway, to the point that re-using the same skill is unlikely.

Just as a sort of example, let's say I have about... 100 SWA with a wind tome and 75 wind ATK on a character. Just for the sake of making it easier to track, let's assume this character is not a Grand Summoner and therefore can't use Evoke Mastery, and currently doesn't have a youkai installed.

With those stats, Air Pressure would do only slightly less damage compared to the wind elemental evoke skills, while costing roughly 7 less FP per cast and having a better range to work with, with Hunter Wind generally being the only one that'd be worth using compared to that unless I really needed Mare Wing's air shaft at that moment. And Air Pressure uses 100% wind ATK and 100% SWA, while there are other spells that scale better, have decent effects, okay range and still end up costing less FP compared to a level 60 youkai skill.

The wide majority of elements end up being the same on that front, as far as I can tell. Comparing Fir to Fire Wail, for example, or Miu to Ice Jet, just to give a few examples. I'm not saying that youkai spells need to be on par with other player spells by any means, but when these spells end up costing far, far more while doing far, far less, it kind of feels like there's very little point to actually using them in the first place.

Sure, both of the stats I mentioned can still be a good deal higher in a lot of cases, but as far as I can tell, unless you're building specifically to use youkai spells of a few specific elements, using spells from other classes is generally better, and some spells simply being a single target damage move within 4-5 range with minimal or no additional effect doesn't help matters. The main advantage the Summoner evoke skills have is that they don't need a specific weapon in the first place, really, but needing to use more FP for generally less effect doesn't quite seem like a worthwhile trade off when you need to burn through FP to keep a youkai on the field already.

The ideas you mentioned for changing the existing passives are still a pretty good solution, definitely, and I agree with pretty much everything else you and everyone else here has said. Just wanted to clarify that, while you can bring the evoke costs down to a point where they're usable, a small handful of them still don't really feel worthwhile, generally.
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Messages In This Thread
Regarding youkai spell costs - by SolAndLuna - 09-14-2020, 06:37 PM
RE: Regarding youkai spell costs - by Senna - 09-14-2020, 07:00 PM
RE: Regarding youkai spell costs - by Autumn - 09-14-2020, 08:51 PM
RE: Regarding youkai spell costs - by Perdition - 09-15-2020, 01:50 PM
RE: Regarding youkai spell costs - by SolAndLuna - 09-18-2020, 04:32 AM

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