[Slydria]

Most of the Overcharge effects of the Magic Gunner Shells ignore RES despite not being listed as unresistable damage.

This applies to Blaze Shell, Celsius Shell, Bright Shell and Sonic Shell. (Chain Shell's Overcharge doesn't ignore RES.)

[Mivereous]

http://neus-projects.net/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2368

[Slydria]

Thought I was missing a thread somewhere.

Anyway, I guess it's not a bug but I think they shouldn't be 'unresistable' damage.

[Ranylyn]

Considering the FP cost to Overcharge, the cooldown on it during which time you don't have any shell effects at all, and the fact that a non "One Overcharged" Overcharge could realistically be dropped to 0 damage if it was resistable, I've gotta say that if they WERE resistable, MG would basically be complete trash outside of Akimbo. And while One Overcharge effects are really strong, single shot guns still lose out to Multishot even with the damage being unresistable, so making them resistable would just throw singleshot back in the "why does this even exist and waste game code" bin.

(Of course, if it was Charge Mind levels of 500+ damage, that would be another story. But non "One Overcharged" Overcharges don't come close to even 1/5 of that much... on a class that basically exists to deal damage with very limited support options)

Just my two cents.

[Rendar]

Except single shot guns have more benefits than you can possibly imagine.

They're more accurate ((And make Magnet Shell actual hell))
They lower your movement more (and make your life actual hell))
Null Shell of Doom
SOUND SHELL OF NEVER ATTACKING WITH BASICS AGAIN...

Some shells, if they were resistable, lose the damage aspect of them. Does this make them bad? Hell no it doesn't. Sound Shell horrendously beats people over the head because of the sheer size of the AoE it provides, Hesitation, Silence, and Knock Down. Null shell removes rogues and people who buff from existance. Magnet shell removes dodgers from existence.

[Ranylyn]

1) Celcius and Sonic Shell need nerfs anyways. Also, if you're so dependant on baiscs that the sonic shell hesitation is a bigger issue than the knockdown, you may want to reconsider your build, just saying.

2) The accuracy difference between single shot and multishot is entirely dwn to the individual gun. For example, the Jackhammer is a single shot, and is any other weapon in the game as inaccurate? Furthermore, if you're looking at 4 shots (Purely for consistency in numbers because offhand akimbo not getting skill bonuses) vs 1 shot, and even just 2 shots already basically matches the one shot in damage, a slightly lower accuracy would not turn the tides in favor of the single shot gun.

3) Can't magnetisim stack, making the multishot gun better at applying it? (4-6x 15 vs 1x 40?) If anything, based on your comment about the lower accuracy of multishot guns, it'd make Magnetism better with multishot guns, no? Or was Magnetism stacking only with Golem?


Chain shell being resistable works since Overcharge applies all 3 effects, and a 3 are damage; 5x bonus effect + 10x high charge effect damage that chains to multiple enemies has potential to be complete and utter chaos; 3 + 35 + 70 without One Overcharge, and 12 + 60 + 120 with. That gets completely insane. Over 100 without One Overcharge? Damn straight make that resisteable!

But compare to something like Blaze Shell, which does 3+70 + Level 7 Burn or 12+120 + Level 12 burn. I'm not joking or exaggerating when I say I have characters who would take 0 damage from the non One Overcharged variant if it was resisteable. Again, considering the downsides to overcharging (25 FP, no shell effects at all for two rounds, unless you waste more FP on cooldown and that still prevents you from using it every round) that's unacceptable.

I'd be fine with giving very specific OP shells resisteable overcharges as a nerf if the remaining effects were left intact (Example: Make Sonic resisteable OR nerf the effects, but not both,) but several others, like Blaze, literally only have that damage going for them (Level 12 burn is a complete joke.) So no. Making them resisteable is generally not a good idea. A better idea would instead be to reduce the level of the damage (Example: Turn high charge*8 into high charge*4, kind of thing) on shells with very good effects that basically negate the point of taking other shells.

[Egil]

Ranylyn » Sun Feb 14, 2016 7:42 pm[/url]"]1) Celcius and Sonic Shell need nerfs anyways. Also, if you're so dependant on baiscs that the sonic shell hesitation is a bigger issue than the knockdown, you may want to reconsider your build, just saying.

2) The accuracy difference between single shot and multishot is entirely dwn to the individual gun. For example, the Jackhammer is a single shot, and is any other weapon in the game as inaccurate? Furthermore, if you're looking at 4 shots (Purely for consistency in numbers because offhand akimbo not getting skill bonuses) vs 1 shot, and even just 2 shots already basically matches the one shot in damage, a slightly lower accuracy would not turn the tides in favor of the single shot gun.

3) Can't magnetisim stack, making the multishot gun better at applying it? (4-6x 15 vs 1x 40?) If anything, based on your comment about the lower accuracy of multishot guns, it'd make Magnetism better with multishot guns, no? Or was Magnetism stacking only with Golem?


Chain shell being resistable works since Overcharge applies all 3 effects, and a 3 are damage; 5x bonus effect + 10x high charge effect damage that chains to multiple enemies has potential to be complete and utter chaos; 3 + 35 + 70 without One Overcharge, and 12 + 60 + 120 with. That gets completely insane. Over 100 without One Overcharge? Damn straight make that resisteable!

But compare to something like Blaze Shell, which does 3+70 + Level 7 Burn or 12+120 + Level 12 burn. I'm not joking or exaggerating when I say I have characters who would take 0 damage from the non One Overcharged variant if it was resisteable. Again, considering the downsides to overcharging (25 FP, no shell effects at all for two rounds, unless you waste more FP on cooldown and that still prevents you from using it every round) that's unacceptable.

I'd be fine with giving very specific OP shells resisteable overcharges as a nerf if the remaining effects were left intact (Example: Make Sonic resisteable OR nerf the effects, but not both,) but several others, like Blaze, literally only have that damage going for them (Level 12 burn is a complete joke.) So no. Making them resisteable is generally not a good idea. A better idea would instead be to reduce the level of the damage (Example: Turn high charge*8 into high charge*4, kind of thing) on shells with very good effects that basically negate the point of taking other shells.

Basically this.

I honestly feel that guns aren't that strong (maybe because I use MG heavily and I have more losses than wins despite knowing how to use it effectively), so this thirst for nerfing sonic/celcius shell, MG, or guns in general appears to be bourne from salt rather than actual issues with balance. As for the OP's issue- yeah the descriptions should be updated to be listed as unresistable damage. I've seen Celcius shell's damage get resisted, though, so I'm not sure what tests were conducted to show that its' damage isn't resistable.

[Slydria]

Okay, perhaps you don't understand what it's meant by Unresistable.

Attacks with the Unresistable property ignore DEF/RES. They can still be reduced by Damage Reduction, Elemental Resistance, etc.

[Ranylyn]

We really need to come up with a new term for that, since it seems to come up at least once daily in-game, as well.

Such as, instead of "Deals unresistable damage," how about something along the lines of "Damage that ignores defenses."

[Neus]

I'd prefer to sum it up in one word. And it may be a little confusing but its behavior is consistent.