[MegaBlues]

This is a picture from the forums, but I removed the name to protect anonymity, I guess.

But, no, seriously. When are Vampires going to be hit with the nerf bat? It's ridiculous for anyone to be able to have stats like this, especially from racial skills, not to mention their ability to mitigate Holy damage while still benefiting from anything that causes one to be counted as Possessed.



Also, on an unrelatedish note. Can we have the lore changed to state how opinions of Vampires has changed, or retcon how people have felt about them? Because I'm sure the Lore states that Vampires are generally feared, yet they start with neutral reputation overall, I believe, and I remember someone stating that the only reason to hate Vampires was racism.

(if this actually wasn't a vampire, then whatever allows this to be possible should be looked at, though the bit about lore still stands)

[Rendar]

That's a vampire with Ghost and Hexer.

no HP (+10 to a ton of stats)
Huge Sanctity (+11 or some bs to a ton of stats)
SPOOOKYYYY dark knight (+10 to all stats)

[Snake]

2spooky4me.

But eh, that's a gimmick, and if both Hexer and Ghost keeps getting the OP skills, such as Fellel's and Ether Invitation adjusted and tweaked, this class combination will result in nothing but a statball for fancies. So chillax 'for now', it's not a common absurdity.

(Also, Poison ruins their life.)

[Autumn]

There's no need to protect the name I guess because basically everyone knew that character was a vampire when they were an elf with 900HP pre-GR, that's my character Skye who's been running those classes since I made them, and their entire theme before was being a really stupidly old vampire with a shit ton of dark resistance and as much HP as possible, and was based around fear as a gimmick entirely, it was character theming more than anything.

It just turns out that the character's 'theme' also made them get every single stat in the game, that character is in death knighting and has 60 scaled SAN, so they get +11 to STR WIL SKI CEL DEF from Sanguine crest, +9 to every stat at 10% HP(This part isnt as nearly bad) and death knighting to get +12 to every stat because it's spirited.

I don't think nerfing anything but sanguine crest is necessary here, and to be honest, I think I like the state that sanguine crest's SAN scaling is in, however there is one outlier

at 10 SAN, which is the minimum you get for building 43 APT, gives you +6 to STR WIL SKI CEL DEF for free, and when I say free I mean there are no stat points spent, you just get 30 extra stat points above everyone else in the game because you're a vampire.

So if there was any suggestion I could give? This is a good one for making sure that SAN Vampires don't fall behind and get completely gutted while making sure very low SAN vampires don't outclass everyone for simply being a vampire.

Sanguine Crest can only grant you stats at and after 100 essence, every 15 essence after that gives you +1 to STR WIL SKI CEL DEF (As opposed to 20 as it is now)

This would make it so my +11 stat vampire will go to +9 stats, still nerfing them but not too heavily, while making it so that low SAN Vampires arent getting 30 stat points for no investment.

Edit: Btw these are their stats before death knighting, and rising game.

[Neus]

Seems the original post left out a few key details.

[Cat15]

To note, Bright Darkness actually was already nerfed awhile ago so that it only reduces Holy damage while the vampire is the Vampire race. Using spirits does nullify the mitigation.

Concerning the lore, I believe that vampires having mostly neutral starting reputation is less because people are fine with vampires, and more because it's near impossible for your average person to tell the difference between a vampire and anyone else just through normal social interaction. If I were to take a guess, the lower reputation in Lispool is due to the Church Knights there being trained to spot them.

Additionally, there have been PC vampire hunting groups active, and for the most part the law's looked the other way so long as they aren't attacking suspected vampires in the middle of the street in broad daylight. If you're referring to individual characters being completely fine with vampires, PCs being exceptions to the majority of IC social norms is hardly limited to views on vampires.

[Chaos]

Vampires shouldn't have poor reputation across the board because they're supposed to be secretive as all hell. While YOU are aware that you're a blood-sucking creature of the night, the local neighborhood (and just about everyone else) shouldn't know jack. Not to mention that Vampires tend to prey upon the people and are basically the spawn of Huggessoa, which is where the Church steps in with sword drawn.

Just because (some) Vampire PCs fail to even acknowledge that they're supposed to be a secretive race does not mean we need to change their lore.

Ninja'd while I was writing up the post. Spoiler is basically an echo of what's already stated

Like Sderg said, your picture highlights a gimmick build, which gets a metric ton of boosted stats from two very specific classes. There is also little to no 'mitigation' of the tremendous damage that Holy can do to them while Possessed, nor will they be able to actually sustain themselves from any healing that isn't Silvermist or Vampirism.

It would also help greatly if you could provide better examples, instead of just snatching up a picture on the forums and leaving out any context. (Especially while not specifying what part of Vampire needs a nerf to begin with, while using outdated information)

[MegaBlues]

I should have been clearer with my lack of specific information, that's my mistake. And it probably doesn't look good to be using outdated info either. So I've looked over what's been posted and put this together:

I think that only Death Knighting and Sanguine Crest really need to be touched. Maybe make Death Knighting give +2/3/4/5/6 stats per rank, and bump Sanguine Crest down to Instinct levels? Maybe 100+San essence, and +1 to the effected stats per 25 San?

Also, the lore explanations for Vampires make sense. The other races with negative reputation aren't quite as human-passing as Vampires, even though vampirism isn't usually much of a well kept secret in the RP environment.

[Lolzytripd]

Death knighting is an invocation that lasts 5 turns, costs a butt of fp and can't be hsdw'd, also bonus stats so overload.

I don't see an issue with it currently.

[Snake]

Null Shell.