[Neus]

I'd like to preface this by saying this is just an idea, not something I am actively looking to implement. Simply put, an extra balancing factor for guns would be the need to reload them after shooting them before you can attack with them again. Reloading would require using a skill, the momentum cost of which depends on the gun's Reload Speed stat (alternatively you can just select End Turn and it will automatically reload your guns, in order of main and then sub, if you have the momentum to do so). I haven't really considered what I'd make the default M cost for this action. Probably wouldn't affect Gun skills(?).

Thoughts? Is this necessary or interesting? It could come with some buffs to guns to make them more appealing as sidearms that you use for a quick burst of damage. However, I would worry a bit about that making guns 'too' strong and not fulfilling the intended purpose. Anyway, like I said, this is just a random idea I had late at night. Feel free to offer your opinion.

[Autumn]

Hmm, You could say that a gun has a maximum clip size stated in the weapon description itself, for example

Handgun - Medium Gun
Rounds: 3 - Clip: 12

By this logic it'd allow you to get off 4 basic attacks before having to use a reload skill (lets say 4m cost for now)

I think this would allow guns to gain a few scaling buffs so that they are more about up front burst, but what I'm interested in is the weapon part customization too, like for example the extended grip, which adds +1 round to handguns, this would allow a handgun user to be more bursty but still suffer the drawbacks of reloading.

this also introduces the idea of weapon parts that increase clip sizes, or reduce clip sizes as a debuff for stronger weapon parts, and you could give Demon Hunter and Engineer skills that increase clip sizes, to sort of give them more gun niches so that magic gunner isn't the only 'gun' class in existance atm.

In short, I like the idea and it could introduce unique things to mess around with, and allow gunners to build sustained damage by increasing clip size or increase burst damage by increasing rounds/power/yatta with a decrease to clip size.



On a side note, I had an idea once that Double Dao's effect could perform a basic attack with both guns equal to (Main hand gun rounds + remaining momentum) but with this sort of system, you could say that Double Dao's effect performs a basic attack that shoots as many times as it has bullets left in the entire clip.

[Trexmaster]

I like the concept of guns having a reload stat, especially if they're balanced around the fact. I'm not sure what buffs they could receive to compensate that wouldn't be overbearing, especially if skills used with them circumvent the need, but I like the idea.

I feel like the M cost of it shouldn't be more than 1, considering builds that exclusively use guns for their attacks would be heavily gimped by losing any more than that to continue being able to fight, lest they incorporate another means of fighting into their setup. Hard to say how badly they'd suffer without knowing what they'd get in return, but losing actions is devastating, so whatever it is would need to be worth the M dumped into the shot and reload.

Depending on how its implemented (see: always require a reload if a basic attack is made) Riposte might need to get changed for guns to either not work or actually scale properly.

[Snake]

I so dig for this idea. Coming from someone who uses guns like this 24/7. Just to finish with grace that last second combo where you sidecut, spin around and 'boombah' on their butts. It's just heart-warming when everything connects. And probably will be better after spinning the handgun with a cig, reloading infront of a blasted foe as they angrily look at your suave style.

But anyway! Enough of me fantasizing the far away future addition. As long as it doesn't come as more of an impairment than compensation, it's all good. Maybe it should apply to skills? (It's just ugly to see people lol spamming parting shot or lead storm to avoid having to waste momentum to reload, when it was implemented to balance stuff.)

Still, Guns in general are lacking in damage whenever they're not used with Magic Gunner. So! Could this come with something for Demon Hunters and Engineers? Something like a 1 SP innate that increases gun damage, or improves the scalings so it makes them use SKI and GUI (respectively) for those, while Magic Gunner uses WIL (and obviously making those Gun Enhancing innates only apply if Main Class)?

PS: I've also had some brainstorm about your idea, like, what if it works for different gun subtypes? So there you go if you ever wanna make this more complex than just a simple reload:

- Launcher-type Guns
Reload: 4M
Capacity: 1 use before empty.
> Area of Effect with low hit, high damage.
>Additional 50% damage if the enemy is in the dead middle of the circle (where the rocket lands).
>Damage changed to split evenly between Blunt and Fire.

- Shotgun-type Guns
Reload: 1M [but only reloads 1 bullet per action]
Capacity: 4 uses before empty.
> -25% hit if beyond 2 range, +25% hit if melee.
> Higher base critical damage. (125%)

- Rifle-type Guns
Reload: 3M
Capacity: 1-2 uses before empty.
> (Sniper type) Damage increases per tile of distance you are from the target. The more far, the higher the damage.
> (Assault type) Attacks twice(?), Grants extra momentum on critical hit that doesn't stack with Fleur(?)

- Handgun-type Guns
Reload: 1M
Capacity: 2-3 uses before empty.
> No changes are needed here, mostly because I couldn't think of any buffs for them.

[Ranylyn]

I was actually thinking of suggesting something like this as a mechanic for crossbows, myself. So I'd be on board for trying it.

[MegaBlues]

I'd go so far to say that all ranged weapons aside from Tomes could use an ammo mechanic. Ranged physical has always been superior to melee, so something to bring it into line would be great.

[Autumn]

I wouldn't go as far to say that Megablues, after all swords are king of the physical damage game right now, specifically all of the elemental katana for the most part, due to 2h and bloody palms, not a day goes by where I don't see at least one of those builds but with a different element.

Bows kind of got put in line with the stun update, all that's needed is pulling shot nerfs, other than that, ranged weapons are pretty in line due to Bows gaining the close-shot penalty, and heavy need for GUI to make sure they don't lose too much hit in far ranges.

[Lolzytripd]

This could bring some good reason to add more low rarity guns to the game, such as sawed off shotgin (1 round, 2 chambered) Simple rifle (1 round, 5 clip) ect.

Each gun should have their own clip size.

Quickdraw UL/2
Autopistol 6
Handgun 9
Spirit hunter 20
Shotgun 4 (the icon is a pump action 3 in the bottom chamber setup)
Bandit pistol 8
Excel rifle 5
Seedsniper, grow back 1 round per turn.

[Kameron8]

I like the idea as a concept. Introducing reload speed and ammo capacity would enable guns to be different from one another outside of # of rounds, and also turn them into something outside of bows with shells.

[Soapy]

I actually really really like this idea, but I can already tell it'll be a bitch to balance.

That being said, I think it'd be worth it - as long as feedback isn't dismissed as a kneejerk reaction until three months later.
And only if shotguns reload one shell at a time.