[Shujin]

I propose two changes to how Charge weapons work.

1.) Remove pre charging. Being shot for 600 damage turn 0 is about as bad as getting icicle speared if not worse.

2.) Make charge consume at the beginning of your Basic attack.

Explaination: Currently if your opponent has any form of defensive options against it, The attack will be blocked/Evaded but the charge stacks not consumed, meaning that the Optimal thing for you to happen, damage wise, is if your charge attack only glances, cause it applies the damage Bonus, but does not consume the charge.

This would make Charge weapons alot fairer.

[Autumn]

Pre-buffing in general should probably be changed, with excel charges being a part of a change like this, I believe it was mentioned to be slated to be removed eventually.

Additionally I also think that the fact that charge weapon does not expire on miss/glance to be unintended behavior, I am not sure if its a bug completely but it doesn't seem to be the same as it was before.

[firehawk11]

Without the charges lasting past battles, it makes charges harder to use and like most things would it actually worth it? I ask this question every time I use a buff skill in SL@, is it worth it to use this vs raw damage? It's a true back and forth on one hand pre-battle buffing is horribly broken, on the other hand how useful is charge weapon without that set up? Is it worth using charge weapon then attack or double charge weapon for an entire turn, is the old conversion glove, shock collr combo still good? It's a lot to go over PvP or PvE wise.

[Shujin]

Charge weapon, even without pre-charging will be still very potent, no worries. The weapons themselves even without charges aren't much weaker than its counterparts.

But this allows people to prepare for it in battle, instead of being cheap shot right off the bat.

And I do not know if not consuming on Evade/Glance/Deflect is a bug or not...I Do kinda remember giving Moxie a Sniper build like that like 4 years ago, and I think it behaved the same there, but I wouldn't trust my old memory on something that long ago. Either way, it is pretty unfair to get infinite tries to land your big shot, with no drawback.

[firehawk11]

Well alright then.

[PantherPrincess]

It is not a bug I believe. Glancing negates on hit effects thus making the charge not go away because the shot glanced. This works the same for a lot of on hit effects or on attacked effects with glancing. I.E. If I have Brighten on and I make my enemies attack glance, the light retaliation damage will not proc either because of how glancing works.

[Rendar]

I mean.

I think we should all address the elephant in the room that this thread is almost certainly based on.

Kiss Farewell mutating into a bow. The problem is two fold. A mixture of it being a long-ranged handgun (bow). It getting the benefit of immediate turn-1 Longdraw.

And the fact that Gust Arrows persist through combat (so you can pre-buff). Ontop of Excel charges persisting through combat.

Allowing for the bow user to turn 1 initiative run within range of you (See: Usually 15~18 range).. And then promptly shoot you for a full excel charge. If, somehow, you dodge, they take no penalty and can-- next turn-- just attack again. (This is an engine we are firing to enhance the attack. It should be lost, whether hit or miss). If you didn't dodge as a dodger, you probably just lost 90% of your health, if not all of it in 1 hit. If you're a tank, you still have likely lost 30%ish of your HP from half-the map away and will, still, need to move something like 7 momentum, or more, to get yourself within range.

The problem is a lot of things. Buffs persisting through combat is definitely the main one.

[Autumn]

Like I said, I don't think its a bug, but it is a feature that is sort of undesirable now that excel weapons are real weapons with the advent of the scaling changes.

[Poruku]

The glancing thing seems like a bug to me. Doesn't proc desperado striker or assault order either, allowing you multiple chances to land a oneshot (in the case of desperado, it doesnt crit but you still lose durability so it's actually working against you imo.)

[Lolzytripd]

If we remove pre charging, can we increase the % bonus to excel crash skills as some sort of recompense.

the 10, 20, 30% they receive as a bonus to damage isn't in the same ball park as what excel basic attacks get.