[renowner]

I personally am of the mind that Full Swing has always been overpowered. Weapons that can get it are amazing, weapons that can't are worse because of it. +20 added to SWA is kind've absurd.

I would think the idea would be to make the game more fast paced and to let damage dealers deal more damage, but in reality that isn't even the case. Healers use it too, to heal more. Long ranged people can use it too, with mutations or special attacks. . . Can even use it alongside global strikes. . . The idea in concept was fine, but I think the implementation could be changed a little bit.

I would like to instead change it to: Increase the SWA (Or power) of the weapon by 10 (20 if the weight is 20 or higher) when using a skill or basic attack on a target within one range of you.

This would make it so healers don't get full swing boosted healing, which doesn't really make thematic sense anyway.
This would also make it so spells don't get boosted by it either, which also kind've doesn't make much thematic sense. And I think its kind've stupid that people mutate or arcanize weapons so much because they just end up being way better tomes. . When tomes are literally designed to be the spellcasting tool.
This would also make it so melee fighters can close the power level gap that ranged fighters currently have over them a bit. 
And also would have the effect of making howling handshot no longer way better than every other bow that exists.

And this would still speed up combat potentially by giving melee non dagger people something in their corner.

[Autumn]

I don't think the 20 SWA from full swing actually matters all too much, it only sucks when you compare fist weapons to the martial weapons but thats a fist exclusive problem.

I actually just don't think Full Swing is a problem and rather the lack of support for certain dual wielding setups is a bit of a bummer, as Full Swing benefits from more than just +20 SWA, it also benefits from having a glove slot which can be infinitely better than a second weapon most of the time, +5 hit/fp as a baseline, possibly some stats or a interaction-changing effect of some sort on that glove slot.

In this sense I actually think that you don't need to nerf Full Swing, I disagree with that, I think alternative solutions should be introduced to aid in the shortcomings of dual wielding, as it stands currently the only reason to dual wield is to use Sarasha Gi, which requires 2 of the same type of weapon.

I'd rather a 3rd subtalent for 2hand be introduced, one that gives benefits to dual wielders.

[Shujin]

I too think its more about the lack of support for the alternatives, than it is for Full swing being a problem.

It only feels so much better and overwhelming cause the only thing dual-wielders MAYBE get is Sarasha Gi bonuses, which isn't even making it the best evade armor anymore (12 crit do be nice though.)

So I rather see that style getting something nice. So agree with Autumn. And if that's a nono, yeh nerf that shit, its currently with no doubt the most effective way to build in almost all scenarios that are applicable.

[renowner]

I mean. . . It also generally makes shields not so worth using over knight ring too, since you'd be trading some elemental resistances (That accesories and boots can already provide) for two hand, too.

And bulwark is main class only, and only from the front.

[Poruku]

Two hand in a vaccum is overpowered, but it's also kind of a weapon class balance element. I think it's okay for it to exist honestly. Steady is also op. But shields are pretty good!

[Kazzy]

Shields suffer from a similar issue to a great many things. Like Bows.

They're JUST stat sticks. 3 def? Alright, I guess. The big thing is guard and elemental resistance. The problem, however, is that gloves are widely just. . .Better. Stats wise, Effect wise, Just mostly around. Unless you have a niche build that revolves around, say, the undead hating shield. Or a Fang-faced. Or a Skull Shield.

The solution? More interesting effects. Or even just a skew of numbers. How would I do it? No idea. But I'd probably start by giving the current lineup of shields the stink eye and figuring out something neat to do with 'em. But expanding past the wheelhouse of 'Small stat buff, Big elemental resist' or 'This is the shield that hates X race of monsters' would be a decent place to start.

[Lolzytripd]

So the biggest issue for me is if you are dual wielding weapons of different types you get nothing. You are down 20 swa, you are down the power or utility of a glove or shield, and you won't qualify for twin dance even if you have a rogue promo.

[renowner]

Two hand needs competition for different build types for sure.

[caliaca]

I think str based critters kind of need this to be competitive due to how bad their stat distributions are.

But... Non str based critters benefit from it as well and don't even need the help.

I'd personally like to see bonuses for other types rather than nerfing full swing for the reason of str based critters, but if not the idea of it only applying in mellee could help but still hurts some str based critters when they're using skills like reapers scythe due to ending a time on weird range or something similar.

[firehawk11]

In the end of the day why is Two-handed "Overpowered"? Simple most off-hand items aren't strong enough to warrant the want for any item that you can add that good old, +20 SWA can't do better. +3 Defense, -3% Physical damage, so what, 3% of 100 is 3, so wooo for a normal shield you ignore 3 more damage for ever 100 damage you would have taken but you can then argue why not guard? Well you need to deal damage, so you lose 50% damage doing a 3M skill, use 4M guard and reduce damage by 40%, meaning your actually losing on the damagew race since enemies can do 2x60% damage and boom you're dealing 50% and their dealing 60% damage to you out between two attacks which is twice as powerful since 2 attacks, so basically it's 100%-40%=60% for Swing 1, Swing 2 is the same meaning their 60% attacks are now 70% more powerful then your attack. However 1m Guard is effect since now your forcing the enemy to go from 100% to 90% which if you also double attack, you're gaining 10% Damage.