[Kameron8]

Can't even remember if I said this previously but my ideal would be that players get to choose where they start. If that isn't an option more spread out spawns would nice.

This would be another decent option to implement, it was just assumed however long ago when this first came up that it would be a much harder, more time consuming (See: less likely to be added) option than adjusting them to better static positions. But make no mistake, I'd love to see this instead, if a pre-battle position planner was on the table.

[Autumn]

And I as well, if being able to select in area in a limited one. (Like a box similar to our current start) was possible, I'd much much MUCH prefer that.

[FaeLenx]

I put spellthief on as much of my characters that I play in PVP for this exact reason. I'd rather risk getting facerolled at round start by being 1 space away from the enemy team than I would have a sure thing of being in easy AOE range of all of my friends.

[Autumn]

I still very much fear round 0 a Quickdraw gunner running it down vs my team, lead storming and then Bursting down everyone who isn't prepared for it before they can react. (Read: 80% of builds.)

So I think I'll give the whole 'spawn positions could use fixing' one more shot.

[FaeLenx]

Heaven kick knockdown into leadstorm.

One of this game's strongest features that a lot of people rarely ever try because of cheese like this is large scale team fighting.

[Lolzytripd]

Idea for pvp.


Deployment phase, where the two parties get halfs of the battlefield and a minute to choose where to deploy themselves in their zone.

[Snake]

Well, why don't we tackle those separately instead of trying to change the core of the game?

The max I could see Dev doing without stressing out is adjust starting positions based on your weapon's base range. And even then, people will still find a way to cheese it I believe. Yes, pessimistic but holy shit you guys-

A good kickstart is making:
- Quaking Heaven Kick inflict Flatfooted LV25 instead of Knockdown.
- Lead Storm become an autohit skill scaling around 90% to 130%, that damages X times based on your weapon rounds and reduces your next Demon Hunter offensive skill's momentum to 0M.

[Senna]

You can change those but I believe someone already mention something about that. You can change and nerf them but other skills/spells will just simply replace them.

Because the next will be Hexer/DH with first turn CC or LB/DH with first turn CRIPPLING cc or some more crazy ideas like that.

There isn't a reason to change those, just allow others to position themselves in pvp group fights. At certain sections on the map. Ofc keeping the tile distance, just letting them not stand next to each other and within the rush down tactics way.

[Snake]

Even though, those two are being the biggest cases of 'instawin'. There's absolute no counterplay to QHK into (whatever) or a Shaitan MG/DH with Quickdraw showering you with 550 damage before you can even type a battle preparation emote.

Against Hexers you could be a Glykin or Wyverntouched and laugh at their attempts to poison you round 0, while said Hexer is now in deep shit for being surrounded by you and your boys.

Yeah, if that becomes the case, we just weed it out again. No problem. Eventually the game will run out of round 0 cheese to nerf.

[Senna]

With dark claw the way it is that'll happen regardless. They just delete one person at a time and still aoe knock down because sonic shell spreads. That change won't do much. As for the two races, not everyone is going to run that lol. Because if that's the case, both of those run down tactics have a counter as well. The heaven kick? Run a LB that also has max cel and a or two quick draw, or something that makes you go front of cover your ally on knock down immunity. The QD dark claw? Kensei/DH with bullet barrier and divine enchantment. Hell, when run a evasive character who has green scale shits on the QD run down.

There is also the recoil counter play whereas they hurt themselves more than the target with that sword that makes a bubble around you.

There are counter plays just like the set I've listed but the same problem applies to them. One or two things counters them but, they need specific counters--Counters that aren't open to most classes. The pick position at the start of a fight will help with that alot more, so if people choose to spaced out, these zero turn 'int' drop kicks would be much easier to avoid as well as it'll open new strategies so on.

Edit note: Finished my point since my phone was dying when I was making the post before.