[Ranylyn]

(No. The alias in the screenshot is not an ACTUAL "alias." It's her main Youkai's name. I RP the Youkai with the alias and faceicon states.)

Log: http://i.gyazo.com/d3199b499ae53f955655695aa6860ca5.png

For awhile, now, I've noticed that Immolate seems to do too much damage. In this screenshot, I've included Sierra's stats and a snippet from an arena chat log where Immolate (Presumably mitigated by Resistance, since it completely decimates some of my more defensive characters) outdamaged a 25% weakness (that also likely scales against resistance, for the same reasons.) A little bit of simple math shows that without the 25% weakness, Petrification Gaze would have only dealt 20 damage, vs Immolate's 27 unmodified.

This may not seem like much, but at higher levels, it can get fairly absurd. Alanna Whisperwind, my Doriad, has enough Fire Resist to nullify her weakness, and over 50 res. Against level 50+ Wings of Fire, she takes over 70 damage per immolate. Alanna can tank firesplitters better than she can tank Wings of Fire. At least Firesplitters can only boom once.

Could we get a clarification on the mechanics behind Immolate, and possibly discuss ways to make it a bit more in line with other PVE Mob skills?

[Soapy]

Immolate is WIL+Level, so.

And if you think that's bad, you should see sliders..

[Ranylyn]

Soapy » Wed Mar 04, 2015 9:55 am[/url]"]Immolate is WIL+Level, so.

And if you think that's bad, you should see sliders..

1) Huh. I thought it was Wil + Level/2, and was intracting strangely with defenses. The more you know.

2) Sliders will only use slider every 2 turns. Yes, 2x str is brutal. Yes, it is an AUTOHIT. And yes, it can even make a BK hurt. But it will still only be used every 2 turns. So over a 2 turn period, it's basically the equivalent of 3x Str mitigated by 2x defense, which isn't THAT brutal. Also, if a character has skip and is slower than a slider, their passive that makes them go last functions a lot like skip, so you can often still manage to sidestep them as a low Cel class.

You can also use knowledge of WHEN they'll slide to your advantage, since it's every 2 turns, like clockwork, if they're in range. If you have a shield, you can block every second turn, asuming there's only one slider and not multiple alternating turns. Or you can move to force them to push a Barghest across the battlefield while you fight a spectre.

By comparison, a Slider often has Str around/ slightly above it's level. A Wing of Fire typically has Will around/slightly below it's level. So Immolate isn't actually all that much weaker than slider. And they can and will use it every turn. They'll spam it until they're out of FP. It's actually easier now than it was, since they toss weaker spells into the mix, unlike before, to waste their FP. As a doriad, before I got fire resist, I had absolutely no choice but to keep a Chun or Firefox handy for installs against them (As a Fairy/Plant summoner) or I'd get immolated twice in one turn for weakness damage. Even with the fire resist (down to about 5% weakness, IIRC,) 7M Guard spamming, Phoenix Eternal Flame, and Ingrain, they've wiped her out in a crazy without those installs. And did I mention that her Res is absolutely phenomenal?

Anyways, I have no qualms with some things hitting harder and some things being tougher (Like a Jammer Gamma vs a Jammer Delta) but I really do think that if it's going to hit that hard, and stay that way, it should have some balancing factor, like maybe another weakness (Water is a rare element, and Wind, which it only gets a weakness to at level 20+ or so, is largely limited to Evokers/LBs, not counting weak ones like Ghostwind, or Crescent Rook, which is only usable at a range; it misses completely when used point blank.

Someone will undoubtedly bring up the Red Letter, to which I say "So? Just because the Nihilist exists, doesn't mean it's okay to have a random mob that absorbs every element!" You cannot change gear mid-battle, and due to limited inventory and the risk of losing things when you die, the odds of simply carrying one around with you, unless you're actually using it to fight, is low. Heck, I've been playing SL2 for about a year now, and I've still only ever found ONE Red Letter. In the past, with specialized dungeons, you could see in advance, "Oh, fire altar, let me get my red letter." But now you can't. Luckily, nothing seems to use ice in PVE, but some other gear did not get off so lucky (Stuff like the Ensui and Narcus need to be rotated around like clockwork, and unless you're the party leader, using something that can be absorbed as a primary weapon is downright suicide, now. Your party will not care and charge in.)

Sorry. I got off topic near the end, there, but I swear it was only due to it's relevance. Anyways, Wings of Fire aren't THAT bad, but when they hit THAT hard, and so few classes have good counters to them, it does seem kind of silly, so I thought I'd make this thread.

[MegaBlues]

Just to point some things out.

Random mobs can get Famiuga now.

Multiple sliders can exist in one battle.

Elemental resistance setups exist that let you mitigate mostly everything that monsters can throw at you, elementally.

[Neus]

I'll look into Immolate when I can.