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  [2.49] Volcanic wont Trigger
Posted by: Asellia - 09-01-2021, 08:10 AM - Forum: Bug Reports - Replies (5)

For some reason, my volcanic wont trigger on my burngada. The fireballs don't happen with I crit, no matter what.

System: Debug: Total Power for Burngada / Burngada was 100.


System: Debug: Before Use Skill called. Electrojam, OOC Chopper, Attack, 1


System: Debug: Attack type: /obj/skill/fe_attack. attack_nums:


System: Debug: Total Power for Burngada / Burngada was 100.


OOC Chopper attacks Electrojam with Burngada!


Critical Hit! Electrojam takes 133 Slash physical damage.


System: * Initial Damage: 116.15 Slash Physical, flags: , sk: null, wep: Burngada / /obj/items/equip/weapon/axes/burngada * play_atk_anim was 1. * 46 Evade VS 192 Hit. *2 Roll(s) Remaining. This one was a hit. *1 Roll(s) Remaining. This one was a hit. * Critical check: 79 Critical VS 23 Critical Evade. (116.15) * Critical hit multi was 141. (163.771) * armor was allowed. armor_reduc was 5. (158.771) * spec_flat_reduc was 0. (158.771) * amp_multi was 1. (158.771) * reduc_multi was 83.8. (133.051); MAG DEF, 16.2 PHYS DEF, 100 REDUC * elem_reduc was 0. (133.051) * Damage caps applied. (133.051) * Damage shields applied. (133.051) * Final damage was: 133.


OOC Chopper recovered 2 FP.


Resist! Electrojam takes 12 Fire magical damage.


System: * Initial Damage: 27 Fire Magic, flags: no_armor, bonus, magic, sk: null, wep: Burngada / /obj/items/equip/weapon/axes/burngada * play_atk_anim was . * Critical check: Defender was critical immune or crit_multi was 0. (27) * spec_flat_reduc was 0. (27) * amp_multi was 1. (27) * reduc_multi was 89.2. (24.084); 10.8 MAG DEF, PHYS DEF, 100 REDUC * elem_reduc was 50. (12.042) * Damage caps applied. (12.042) * Damage shields applied. (12.042) * Final damage was: 12.


System: * basic_attack(atk:OOC Chopper,def:Electrojam,W:Burngada,dmg_mod:1,hit_mod:0,crit_mod:0,crit_dmg_mod:0,spec_flags:,auto_hit:0,dmg_scale:0,counter:0,magic_atk:0,ignore_onhit:0,dtype_rep:,retal_ok:1,auto_crit:0,fatal:1,ignore_closes:0,dmg_scale_post:,attack_num:1) * atk_multi was 115. atk_bonus was 0. dmg_scale was 0. * crit_multi was 141. crit_dmg_flat was 0. attack_num was 1.


I want to make clear that it's never gone off so far-- no matter how many times I've done it, how many fights. It's not the once per round limit.

Edit: Also the electrojams dont do damage back, just like the bug with lava slimes.

Edit 2: I relogged, and re-equipped weapon. Now it fireballs work. ???

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  Elemental Augment 2.49
Posted by: Raigen.Convict - 08-31-2021, 11:34 PM - Forum: Balance Fu - Replies (1)

So with the invention of GR 2 now we can safely say guns aren't gonna be a problem with certain on hits, can we now allow elemental augment to properly deal damage with guns?

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  Hotbar attack, sub-attack and special attack mixing up [2.49]
Posted by: Poruku - 08-31-2021, 08:56 PM - Forum: Bug Reports - Replies (1)

Steps to reproduce:

1: Have two weapons and/or the Special Attack 1 trait
2: Drag all of your attack actions to the hotbar
3: Try to use each button of the hotbar
4: Observe the results
5: Finish the battle and start a new one
6: Try to use each attack button again
7: Observe the results

I've yet to find consistent results, but very often special attacks will become mixed up, usually making each of the buttons on the bar activate the same action. This was tested with the bow special attack "skyshot", where the normal attack button dragged to the hotbar would always make me use skyshot. But the axe special attack did not seem to get mixed up with the normal attack

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  Profile music starting after closing window [2.49]
Posted by: Poruku - 08-31-2021, 08:43 PM - Forum: Bug Reports - No Replies

Steps to reproduce:

1: Open someone's profile which has a background music set. One you have not opened this session
2: Close the profile window immediately


Usually, the profile music will begin playing as long as it hadn't yet loaded before the window was closed. To make it stop, you need to open a new profile.

There is also a strange interaction with the mute button. Sometimes, muting the music before it fully loaded will make it start playing after closing the window.

This bug is quite old but I've not found any recent topics about it, so I'm making this one

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  Southern Wind 2.49
Posted by: Raigen.Convict - 08-31-2021, 07:01 PM - Forum: Bug Reports - Replies (1)

Southern wind is saying it grants 4, 7, and 10 evade by rank but in battle before doubling but instead in battle my readout is telling me 7 at max with no south bonus and 14 with the south bonus.

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  Defensive Hunter (Demon Hunter defensive skills thread)
Posted by: Snake - 08-31-2021, 04:20 PM - Forum: Balance Fu - Replies (4)

Quote:Know No Pain

Rank 1 - 5% + (Scaled SKI/2) + (Scaled DEF/2)% chance to parry martial weapons (-20% damage). Grants bonus Rage Energy equal to 50% of the reduced damage.
Rank 2 - 10% + (Scaled SKI/2) + (Scaled DEF/2)% chance to parry martial weapons (-30% damage). Grants bonus Rage Energy equal to 75% of the reduced damage.
Rank 3 - 15% + (Scaled SKI/2) + (Scaled DEF/2)% chance to parry martial weapons (-40% damage). Grants bonus Rage Energy equal to 100% of the reduced damage.

The reason is because due to its Armor reduction, Matador Stance's KnP is not really acting as a reliable defensive skill, especially if the enemy has ways to reduce your Armor to 0. (Wear Out potential from the 5 Armor Penetration series). So in a summary, Know No Pain makes you take more damage overall and this is bad enough to warrant a change.

Quote:Retaliate

If Rage Energy is at 200 or more:
- Ignores Evasion.
- Knocks the enemy back by 1 tile per 50 Rage Energy used, ignoring Knockback immunity.

At that point you took too much damage for the sake of a build up. It's only fair IMO.

Quote:Bullet Barrier

Rank 1 - 10% + Scaled LUC% chance to deflect ranged basic attacks, while lowering own Gun's durability by 8.
Rank 2 - 20% + Scaled LUC% chance to deflect ranged basic attacks, while lowering own Gun's durability by 4.

Adjusted to match the update changes. Still believe this should have no limitation in the trade of Durability down. I hope this also encourages the classic Gun + Sword gameplay that Demon Hunter hints to be the way so much.

Quote:Snake Dancer

Rank 1 - On evade, steps to a random direction and grants Sonic Speed LV15 for 2 rounds.
Rank 2 - On evade, steps to a random direction and grants Sonic Speed LV15 for 4 rounds.

Proccing Snake Dancer should definitely have something to it. Using the Flottement argument, it does grant damage bonus on Sidecut/Sillcut, so this could grant a wittle more Evade.

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  [v.2.49] Maddest Chop (and ether issues)
Posted by: JamOfBoy - 08-31-2021, 03:36 PM - Forum: Bug Reports - Replies (1)

So. Testing for this is light, but I've noticed certain skills doing way more damage than they should.

In this instance, I focused and tested Mad Chop, but I have heard similar feelings about Ether Invitation and so on.

Mad Chop is doing way more damage than it should.

The testers in this situation are bog-standard and don't have any particular damage modifiers/ways to take or deal increased damage. The one with Mad Chop has 138 base SWA and gets Battle Rush to bump it up to 143.

[Image: SG2OqBq.png]

Mad Chop is at rank 5 and thus does 120% of 143 SWA. He's at full HP,

[Image: KEHnISI.png]

so Mad Chop should be doing 171 damage before DR. Nothing else should affect damage.

[Image: eSOuGux.png]

Yet the end result is much higher.

[Image: ElZC52V.png]

One thing to note there is the 255.9 initial damage. What. How. 

A theory I initially had is that the SWA multiplier is applied multiple times, but I don't think this is entirely the case. Either way, something is up, and if Ether Invitation is iffy as people tell me it is, I would wager it has something to do with missing HP being a factor in end damage. Debug logs have no insight into this beyond sudden increase in damage.

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  The Flaws and Benefits of Version 2.49
Posted by: Autumn - 08-31-2021, 02:13 AM - Forum: Balance Fu - Replies (50)

Its been a good couple of weeks since the 2.49 version dropped onto Live and now that a decent portion of the builds have been developed and put into practice, let me just explain a lot of my frustrations and concerns I've had since all the changes dropped onto the test server.

I would very much like to make it clear that 2.49 has brought us a lot of beneficial changes as well, infact a majority of the update I am all a fan for, those being things like:

-Weapon scaling adjustments/tags
-Stat readjustments, causing hit/evade builds to not rely on luck
-Accuracy/Evade normalization and rebalancing.
-Magic Gunner's mini-rework
-Avoidable secondary effects
-Basic Attack and Damage system overhaul
-Multi-hitting no longer being a nightmare to balance


All of these changes here, without going into too much detail about them, have all been lovely. All of these changes will be overly helpful towards balancing the game and finally normalizing the power scale of the likes of Hexer and Tanky damage dealers.

But easily the biggest, most expansive and unfortunately the most flawed change of them all is the evasion system rebalance and overhaul. There is a huge slieu of areas to cover when addressing this update, but lets start with the benefits I wish to see preserved moving into any other system, those being:

-Avoidable Secondary Effects
-On-Evade effects proccing on glancing/evasion

These two effects should remain to some capacity, they've been two very beneficial bonuses that will serve to keep autohits in line no matter what system it is ultimately shifted to.

Now lets go into the flaws of the new system.

Evade is too Good and Polarizing

Simply put, Evade is much too polarizing now to deal with, unless your role was very explicitly just a support that only relied on interacting with your allies, you will now be required to invest tons upon tons of hit to interact with your opponents with, otherwise you will hard lose a matchup simply because you were not allowed to hit them. This, to me is a very toxic gameplay pattern that will only detract from the game's longevity.

If you cannot hit your opponent, and do not have access to a reliable source of damage, you lose, end of the equation. And that feels really really bad, this is why I think that the current evade system is too toxic for the game.

Because evade is too good, the existing counter-play is to stack as much hit as humanly possible so that you can reliably hit your opponent, and in doing so I have felt very very bad for my opponents already because I simply will not play to the evade game in its current state, infact no one will, leading into my next point.


The Actual Numbers

It feels weird to say, but the reason why Evade is weak, is because its simply too good. Because the counter-play to Evade is to stack hit as high as possible to reliably move past it, evade builds end up feeling weak because the counter-play is available to so many more builds now, practically everyone can stack hit, with blessed, Guile and various other easy-to-obtain hit mods being available to them on a whim, the best builds are just removing some of their other stats in favor of these ones. Granted this has taken down some defensive builds, but not all of them, leaving the best ones untouched.

Lets put one of my builds into light, a Verglas who, as a papilion, is allowed absurd SKI investment, but 60 scaled is not unreachable to other races either.

[Image: GQ8xzrI.png]

To note, they are using a blessed weapon, so they're gaining 25 hit from blessed + divine sign, 10 hit for their fist from Trained fists, and up to 20 hit from FAO, the result?

[Image: L4AoWIA.png]

296% hit is my maximum, since flanking bonus ignores the cap but chivalry does not I'm showing my hit from the back here, this is a REALLY high number for this new system, like not a lot of people are getting this much easily, but its still there for those who scale from FAI (Such as FP intensive classes like MAs or summoners would be)

Putting another thing into view, this is evade as a comparison when I am fully stacked, Unarmored Body for +10, FAO +20, Hare Stance for +30, 26 evade torso.

[Image: ZIctsoE.png]

Evade doesn't even come remotely close to the bonuses you can get for hit. 


No One Wants to Deal with it

Since no one wants to be the 150-200 hit Andy who just gets evade walled and dies because they can't hit anyone, the current flock of builds are gravitating towards the high end of the hit spectrum, or they're relying entirely on evasion-ignoring mechanics to just bypass the need entirely.

Putting a few into example are excel-crash fire mages spamming Fir/Explosion, Firebirds utilizing the best parts of their kit or throwing bombs/grenades on repeat until the target dies, of course a lot of this is met with various other forms of counter-play, but the mass result is your evade build is invalidated by all of the above most of the time.

Because the general populace does not want to get evade-walled and for very very good reason, evade ends up weak, and tank ends up being safer as a result, turning us right back to square one when people end up deciding their builds.

Another thing that I can note, is that in the current landscape of builds, if you are playing as an evade build, you die in like 3-6 hits unlike before, where evasion would at least keep you in the game for a reliable amount of time, especially since 80% of the populace wasn't just hitting you through your mechanic.


Conclusion

In conclusion here, there are a lot of frustrations to be had with the new evade system, and I encourage many more people to share their own thoughts on the matter, because I am of the opinion that if none of this changes, evasion is gonna detract so, so much from the game.

My opinion is that I preferred the old, more reliable evade system, but I am also a fan of some of the changes that were made, such as avoidable secondary effects and the hit/evade caps, I would like to see Evade being higher as a base (such as through buffing torso items) with the trade-off that you cannot truly evade autohits anymore, with the reduction being as high as 45% with no additional modifiers and further segregate who and who can't evade.

I think that 45-50% reduction would be fair if the stat was more reliable, especially if it procs on-miss effects still, which allows the likes of Duelist, Kensei and Martial Artist to thrive from those effects.

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  Debuffs are buffs too! (Debuff/Buff cap thread)
Posted by: Snake - 08-31-2021, 01:45 AM - Forum: Balance Fu - No Replies

Buffs and Debuffs should both cap at 50.

I don't really need to say much on this beyond how unfair it is to only have one single defensive option and then have it razed to the ground because your so hard-earned Evade is headbutted like the poor victim of a ram in heat. The same goes on the opposite side.

Plus, many people who are not following the changes do assume the debuffs are capped, so it kind of helps with the general understanding anyway, while making things more fair on both sides of the spectrum, as much as I'd vouch for the maximum 'self-benefits' one should ever be able to grasp is 75 total. (Buffing self for 50, then debuffing the enemy for 25.), solely because 50 then 50 is just 100, which means 'no chance'.

Tad unbalanced, in my opinion, but so be it. I don't think it needs to be so complicated.

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  Ow my ears (Bellringer thread)
Posted by: Snake - 08-31-2021, 01:31 AM - Forum: Balance Fu - Replies (4)

Bellringers are now too strong given they can fully ignore evasion, and on top of that, hit all enemies like a truck.

Surprising to put up a thread on something that's not PvP but, can Crippling Tone gain a 3 round cooldown for how hard it tends to shatter any unprepared team/dodge-only team? Due to Haunted Manors, they're no longer a 'gimmick' monster anymore. They're a part of your everyday life, that can fuck you up if spawned by a Necromancer boss.

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