[Lolzytripd]

How is it not true, san gives less Fp than it initially did, Faith only gives a small amount of fp, while willpower brings home the money on fp gains.

If you don't invest in willpower you suffer fp wise, unless you equip fp increasing items.

[Kameron8]

Because Will, like Strength, is an offensive stat. Just because it also boosts FP doesn't make it a utility or non-offensive (core??) one -- that'd be like calling Strength the Battle Weight stat. Will's functionality has extended to encompass mage damage since before and after the Great Reckoning, with very few exceptions.

[catabur]

Yeah, basically what Kam-Kam said.

And it's not really that hard to get 200 FP with only 15 base WIL.

[Lolzytripd]

yeah and willpower wasn't a part of non mages elemental attack pre gr either

Skills like crystal rose and oilchain scaled off pure old stats skill and str.

Dear god I can keep looping back every positive arguement for making willpower elemental attack for mages as a reason that it shouldn't be part of the elemental attack for weapon users, this thread was made for mages, when the living hell did you turn it into a god damn veiled attempt to nerf elemental attack for non spell casters.

[Kameron8]

yeah and willpower wasn't a part of non mages elemental attack pre gr either

Skills like crystal rose and oilchain scaled off pure old stats skill and str.

Dear god I can keep looping back every positive arguement for making willpower elemental attack for mages as a reason that it shouldn't be part of the elemental attack for weapon users, this thread was made for mages, when the living hell did you turn it into a god damn veiled attempt to nerf elemental attack for non spell casters.

To be clear, yes old crystal rose and other related skills scaled off of the old offensive stat used by the class. The last post I made is completely irrelevant to that, because all I'm saying is that you're wrong if you're calling Will utility, and not offensive. It would be a vast stretch to not classify it as such.

And to try and realign this thread, let's just point out what's been drowned out in six pages of thread:

1. The main idea of this thread is to factor Will in as part of the formula for Elemental Atk.
2. Doing so hurts builds that don't run Will, which leads you to one of two conclusions:
a. Those builds deserve a cut to their Elemental Atk, and need to factor in Will if they want to benefit fully from offensive elemental skills.
b. The entire idea needs to be reworked in a way that doesn't hinder non-mages in their current state.

If you're like me and several of the other people posting here, you align with the former. You and a few others align with the latter. This got scrambled into

3. Defensive scalings are out of hand on weapons and Elemental Atk.

At this point Dev, as far as I can tell, wants to implement the change as a means to cull enormous earth, water, and darkness attack by just investing in defensive stats. The change to making Will significant in the formula accomplishes this. And even still, weapons were brought into this thread because they had relevance to the tank stat Elemental Atk point which had relevance to the original idea. That's the jist of this cluster fuck, as far as I can tell. I still think the original idea is a good idea, and will positively impact the state of the game as a whole. And -yes-, that does mean you can't use rebelling dragon remains brawler's gloves to throw suns at people for quite as much damage with 60 defense and 60 resistance.

[Trexmaster]

yeah and willpower wasn't a part of non mages elemental attack pre gr either

Skills like crystal rose and oilchain scaled off pure old stats skill and str.

Dear god I can keep looping back every positive arguement for making willpower elemental attack for mages as a reason that it shouldn't be part of the elemental attack for weapon users, this thread was made for mages, when the living hell did you turn it into a god damn veiled attempt to nerf elemental attack for non spell casters.

Non mages didn't have elemental attack pre-gr. It wasn't a thing before the GR.

Yes, they scaled on stats those classes were supposed to have for doing things their class was supposed to do anyways, and now those stats have been converted into elemental attack in those equations. There was a suggestion buried in this thread to alleviate this issue (it's on like, page 3 iirc), but, we'll see what Dev might end up doing to make this less painful for those cases, or maybe they'll just be left to suffer. Who knows. Could just have them run off the scaled stat instead, now.

As to your last paragraph and some change...Chaos originally suggested the idea for WIL to be 1/4th of where each elemental attack comes from. It solves the same issue (making WIL more desirable to mages/in general), just not in a 'it's better now' way. This way the upper limits of elemental attack remain about the same and a bit harder to achieve. Worst case scenario you'll lose like, 10-12 elemental attack, and very few skills scale any higher than 100% bar Youkai skills (but those are their own bag of worms, and summoners generally rock WIL anyways).

Ninja'd by Kam, but, yeah. I won't comment on the weapon scaling debacle aside from 'less focus on tank stats murdering people is good'.

[Neus]

I've had some second thoughts on this. I'd like to try this as a bonus on top of how it currently works, along with the defensive scaling weapon changes.

My concern is that elemental attack, while beneficial, is not really the main cause of such powerful tanks; the majority of the issue stems from the weapons themselves. Changing the scaling to 75% per stat seems to me, at the present, to not make much of a difference while hurting non-mages somewhat more. The original planned change could come into effect in the future, but for now, we'll try it with 100% of the basic stat, +25% of your WIL (as suggested in this topic), and make the defensive scalings on the weapons mentioned to be what I said in my last post.

If anyone has thoughts after that's out, we can discuss if any further changes are necessary.

[Lolzytripd]

Lets wait and see how it is and then reconvene after ample testing, I'm willing to pause any pvp rp issues if people feel this is unfair aswell.