[Snake]

The most iconic Monk Skill has been forgotten in it's update, help! Can it get a higher weapon scaling matching the other skills, or even more?

I'd go for 'even more' for those reasons:

1- It consumes all Ki, you can't effectively spam it. Not even Setting Sun consumes all your available Ki, so here's something to think on.
2- It does light damage, that can be retaliated by a certain item.
3- Cobra exists. Wraithguard exists. Evasion exists. Light Resistance is easily stackable.
4- It does nothing extra but damage, and it seems to be terribly lacking it.
5- It should probably 'beam' the enemies at 30 Ki, something I'm owing you badly, icon wise. So allow me to wrap this up for once! http://www.neus-projects.net/viewtopic.p...375#p22189

I'd go for:
Rank 1: 80% WPN ATK + 60% Light ATK + Ki consumed * 1 magic Light damage.
Rank 2: 90% WPN ATK + 70% Light ATK + Ki consumed * 1 magic Light damage.
Rank 3: 100% WPN ATK + 80% Light ATK + Ki consumed * 2 magic Light damage.
Rank 4: 110% WPN ATK + 90% Light ATK + Ki consumed * 2 magic Light damage.
Rank 5: 120% WPN ATK + 100% Light ATK + Ki consumed * 3 magic Light damage.

If things end up a bit too much, slap a cooldown and we're K.

[Joseph Jostar]

if setting sun wasn't already the 'end of round' attack, i'd muse about the suggestion of making it stronger but end of round (monk charging up) so that two monks could clash their kadouhas, the winner probably being whoever spent more ki on it

[Kameron8]

Just pull power from Setting Sun and Kadouha can get enormous damage improvements. It currently has no place anywhere in anyone's build, ever. It's that bad.

[Ranylyn]

5- It should probably 'beam' the enemies at 30 Ki, something I'm owing you badly, icon wise. So allow me to wrap this up for once! viewtopic.php?f=10&t=4375#p22189

Dev said no because of memes a long time ago, if you recall. So please, no. I appreciate the effort you put into the icon, but no more memes.


That said, I think your suggestion is ALMOST fine besides that. And since it consumes all Ki, it basically has it's own built-in cooldown unless you spam the 0 Ki version, which is hilariously inefficient anyways. A 2 turn cooldown could also prevent the 0 Ki version from being spammed, while still allowing a Kadouha-7M Power Up-Kadouha flurry across 3 turns if you really wanted to do it that way. My one concern is that most 120% SWA attacks don't also sport elemental scaling on top of it, so it could potentially become a bit too much of a "must-have" skill for monks. Again, though, considering that it uses all Ki, it could actually be fair. I'm admittedly on the fence.

[Snake]

5- It should probably 'beam' the enemies at 30 Ki, something I'm owing you badly, icon wise. So allow me to wrap this up for once! viewtopic.php?f=10&t=4375#p22189

Dev said no because of memes a long time ago, if you recall. So please, no. I appreciate the effort you put into the icon, but no more memes.

Once upon a time, he also responded to my suggestion about "Can Kadouha have a trail to look like a beam, Dev?" with http://www.neus-projects.net/viewtopic.p...271#p11271 (For reference, see the DATE of this.) He shut me down with his line, so I put it to work after getting inspired by the Monk Update.

And you say SL2 is free of OOC memes? Cirno memes on LaPlace and the ring. Devil May Cry memes in Demon Hunter. Dragon Ball evident memes in Monk. Frozen memes in Verglas.
Not that I'm blamming Dev for anything here, but this is not a 100% 'super duper revolutionary new and unique game with original aspects and every other game/reference should fuck the heck off', a lot of aspects have been based in some minimal OOC jokes because this is also supposed to be a fun 'game'.

Why is it so much of a nuisance if our 'Hadouken' becomes 'Shinku Hadouken' at max power?

Do you think this will even become a 'meme', or do you feel like being lectured about what 'real' memes are like? Ones that I often see people throwing around ICly that even 'I' get ticked off by?


Also, also. Don't worry about the SWA vs Light ATK part, there's only one fist that scales from FAI, and it has a terrible one. If it becomes mandatory for a Monk? Even better. Setting Sun is a bigger nuisance, takes more time to complete the gorgeous animation and only works for tanks.

[Ranylyn]

I said no "more" memes. I never claimed the game is devoid of them, I just think that SL2 shouldn't be renamed "Meme Central." Some people do prefer to actually roleplay instead of just spewing 4th-wall breaking memes that don't even fit SL2's lore.

[Neus]

I try not to overmeme. I will take inspiration from certain things, as you've all noticed, and reference them in some way, but usually I try to put an original spin on them.

Not much to say on the topic as a whole other than Kadouha could get some scaling adjustments, if needed.

[Snake]

Well, back on topic because talking about memes in the mid of something serious leaves a bad taste in my mouth. (Since Dec/2016, for Ranys)

A small input of mine is: You can go wild on Kadouha buffs, it simply uses an Elemental ATK a Monk will never build for and will leave Monk in a bad spot after being used, since it drains all Ki and your Power Up will probably be on a 3 round cooldown. (Something 'new' for it, mechanic wise, would always be welcome, yes.)

[Ranylyn]

Only reason memes came up at all is because that's the only reason to add the "beam." But I agree, let's stay on the mechanical side of things.


Let's assume, for a moment, 100 SWA (again, just because it's an easy number to work with) and 30 Light Attack (Because the Monk in question is pretty unlikely to have much of a use for Faith unless their other class is a Curate or Summoner or something, so let's assume they sunk 20 faith and got +10 from solmancy and an accessory.)

120 base damage
30 damage from Light Attack
45 damage from consuming ALL Ki
___
195 total damage before any reductions, 75 of which is Light elemental

Assuming 40 Def/Res, and 6% light resist from SAN but nothing further from equipment, and also not accounting for Evasion/Cobra/etc, the total damage comes up to a number that's actually pretty fair for something you can't just spam; even if there was no cooldown, the fact that it consumes all your Ki effectively locks you out of some other actions, and Power Up has a cooldown of it's own, now.


The more I think on it, the more fair this all feels. It's kind of Ether Invitation-like in the sense of it being more of a desperate gambit than something to throw out constantly, without the extreme drawback of being dependant on taking damage first. And that's a totally fine trade-off, personally.

[Snake]

By the way, the 'Ki consumption' damage is (Ki * 3) at max level, making it 30 * 3 (90 bonus damage at maximum Ki level), even though I'd not hesitate to go for a higher multiplier so it can be worth in any situation of usage, like for example, giving a Monk the choice to do a combo to finish with a 'decent' damaging Kadouha to finish it, or just release it full power from the distance in hope to get multiple enemies at once for a heavy hitting attack.

Or even making point-blank Kadouhas do double the damage, so it can combo with Dense Thunder's Shukuchi interaction.