02-27-2024, 12:59 AM
Hey guys. Its me again. Worlds worst unsolicited defense attorney for banned folks. Here trying to get more stuff off my chest. And yes, it once again has to do with GM actions, and this is probably my most unfocused rant to ever really exist
Im certain you're tired of these posts, and I am certainly tired of writing them! I told myself I wouldn't write anything this time, and here I am! Admittedly my view on things is alittle less hopeful than the last. I got upset again. I said some mean things. And I admit I am not fully sure if I am still calm yet. But here I am, writing once more. Probably to no real change being made. The only thing I can think of is transparency being abit better. Its nice. Nicer than the alternative of just shadowbanning folks and letting people come up with wild conspiracy theories.
There are new GMs, and naturally, I always expect growing pains. But I've also never seen the GMs ever admit that they made a mistake. They never really want to discuss. They just do things and pray people forget about it in two months. Which will probably happen again, even if its something as serious as making sure somone in the community never gets to come back.
Going past my ramblings and further onto the actual point, I suppose, Recently - There was a ban, after a string of bans I was pretty much okay-ish with or expected. Rather than be vague and have you look it up, I'll just present it here.
Now, Normally, I'd be like "Damn, that sucks. Those are some pretty hefty crimes, and if true, then the punishment is absolutely fair."
Except that isn't the case, actually! Y'see, These crimes were committed around 2+ years ago!
https://neus-projects.net/forums/showthr...p?tid=8764
Now I get it. Doxxing is bad. Its one of the worst things you can do on the internet. But this sets a precedent. And quite frankly rather than watching the GMs flounder around giving multiple statements in the midst of chaos and outrage, Discussion around the subject would probably be better spent with them being able to speak in solidarity. Even if its going to be more of the same. Theres never really any discussion to be had with the GMs in any meaningful- its their word, and its always final. Theres never "we'll do better next time" or "maybe we were wrong."
Apologies for the somewhat pointed topic. But I feel Hoot has shown remorse not only in that post from 2+ years ago, but from their actions since being unbanned the first time. And the GMs feeling the need to dig up old skeletons is a constant thing that I have always not been a fan of. And it felt like it happened all the time with harassment cases in particular for a certain period of time.
Why do we need to stir the pot for something that, in this case, over half the community weren't even *here* for? I dont even some of the GMs were present for this particular incident, even.
Maybe Im not the most level headed person to be starting the discussion at the moment. Im not even the victim. Heck. I have absolutely nothing to do with either party in terms of the accused or the victim. I certainly dont want to downplay their struggles. And I genuinely think what the had to go through was rough. One of the worst things I can probably imagine happening to somone on the internet. You can get harassed, threatened, or even worse even offline as a result of such things.
The reason why laws change retroactively irl is usually because it serves some benefit for the victim. The victim is who matters the most in this case, With my limited knowledge and understanding of the situation as a whole, I dont understand how this helps the victim at all, unless they felt Hoot was going to do it again.
But its also kinda fucked to go back to a years-old case, where it atleast *seems* like both parties have moved on. Hoot, having grown past their mistakes from all that time ago, I feel, from my limited interaction with them atleast. This was one the weird times where a person actually self-reflected on their ban! They knew what they did wrong, as opposed to the usual harassment cases where one is usually hit with it with no idea what their crime even is.
Then they got double-jeopardy'd.
The thing I dont like about this is the fact that if this can happen to Hoot. Whos to say it cant happen to any of the previous bans that we can view today in the now defunct Unban appeals? Or those that happened afterwards? Even the ones before which have no official public record?
You can do one thing wrong and now have it held over your head for the rest of your entire life in this community, even if you've already been punished for it. Admittedly it felt like this could happen already for some. But now, You can get punished *twice* for something you've done. And that punishment? It very well could be a permenant affair.
Do I expect this to actually happen? Well, I'd like to hope not. But I've had more than my fair share of both good and bad experiences from this community alone myself, and its starting to make me feel bitter in general. Right around when I was getting my passion back, I see another thing like this that absolutely needs to be discussed.
Right. Back on track. I think there needs to be a discussion about pushing in bans for things like this. I also am not a fan of retroactively changing ones punishments. This is probably clear from the last few walls, But I want to reiterate
I do not know the full details, But I am of the opinion that Hoot should not have been re-banned for somthing they've already done.
One of the GMs, amidst the chaos of the discord discourse, mentioned that the information is already out there, and that you cant really take that back. Theres no taking back the pain of things that happened in the past-- or could possibly be happening now. I think Doxxing should absolutely be a permenant ban without any tolerance. However, Back then, it -was- tolerated. Going back and changing that now opens a whole can of worms, And I am unsure who it really helps. I feel going forward, Firstly, The ban on Hoot should absolutely be reversed if they were not using the information in question from the doxxing since their ban.
Secondly, If anyone -was- using the information in question other than Hoot, it'd probably be a better avenue of punishment. I cant exactly say whats right or wrong. Im not really a GM, But I feel this is the most fair. But my opinion, in all honesty, after all this time of trying to appeal these things, probably doesn't matter whatsoever.
And uh.. I think thats it. Thats all I got. Hopefully Im not putting myself on the firing line for having the possibly wrong opinion or being abit on the emotional side of things again. At the very least I hope this kicks off productive discussion as opposed to my usual expectation
Im certain you're tired of these posts, and I am certainly tired of writing them! I told myself I wouldn't write anything this time, and here I am! Admittedly my view on things is alittle less hopeful than the last. I got upset again. I said some mean things. And I admit I am not fully sure if I am still calm yet. But here I am, writing once more. Probably to no real change being made. The only thing I can think of is transparency being abit better. Its nice. Nicer than the alternative of just shadowbanning folks and letting people come up with wild conspiracy theories.
There are new GMs, and naturally, I always expect growing pains. But I've also never seen the GMs ever admit that they made a mistake. They never really want to discuss. They just do things and pray people forget about it in two months. Which will probably happen again, even if its something as serious as making sure somone in the community never gets to come back.
Going past my ramblings and further onto the actual point, I suppose, Recently - There was a ban, after a string of bans I was pretty much okay-ish with or expected. Rather than be vague and have you look it up, I'll just present it here.
Now, Normally, I'd be like "Damn, that sucks. Those are some pretty hefty crimes, and if true, then the punishment is absolutely fair."
Except that isn't the case, actually! Y'see, These crimes were committed around 2+ years ago!
https://neus-projects.net/forums/showthr...p?tid=8764
Now I get it. Doxxing is bad. Its one of the worst things you can do on the internet. But this sets a precedent. And quite frankly rather than watching the GMs flounder around giving multiple statements in the midst of chaos and outrage, Discussion around the subject would probably be better spent with them being able to speak in solidarity. Even if its going to be more of the same. Theres never really any discussion to be had with the GMs in any meaningful- its their word, and its always final. Theres never "we'll do better next time" or "maybe we were wrong."
Apologies for the somewhat pointed topic. But I feel Hoot has shown remorse not only in that post from 2+ years ago, but from their actions since being unbanned the first time. And the GMs feeling the need to dig up old skeletons is a constant thing that I have always not been a fan of. And it felt like it happened all the time with harassment cases in particular for a certain period of time.
Why do we need to stir the pot for something that, in this case, over half the community weren't even *here* for? I dont even some of the GMs were present for this particular incident, even.
Maybe Im not the most level headed person to be starting the discussion at the moment. Im not even the victim. Heck. I have absolutely nothing to do with either party in terms of the accused or the victim. I certainly dont want to downplay their struggles. And I genuinely think what the had to go through was rough. One of the worst things I can probably imagine happening to somone on the internet. You can get harassed, threatened, or even worse even offline as a result of such things.
The reason why laws change retroactively irl is usually because it serves some benefit for the victim. The victim is who matters the most in this case, With my limited knowledge and understanding of the situation as a whole, I dont understand how this helps the victim at all, unless they felt Hoot was going to do it again.
But its also kinda fucked to go back to a years-old case, where it atleast *seems* like both parties have moved on. Hoot, having grown past their mistakes from all that time ago, I feel, from my limited interaction with them atleast. This was one the weird times where a person actually self-reflected on their ban! They knew what they did wrong, as opposed to the usual harassment cases where one is usually hit with it with no idea what their crime even is.
Then they got double-jeopardy'd.
The thing I dont like about this is the fact that if this can happen to Hoot. Whos to say it cant happen to any of the previous bans that we can view today in the now defunct Unban appeals? Or those that happened afterwards? Even the ones before which have no official public record?
You can do one thing wrong and now have it held over your head for the rest of your entire life in this community, even if you've already been punished for it. Admittedly it felt like this could happen already for some. But now, You can get punished *twice* for something you've done. And that punishment? It very well could be a permenant affair.
Do I expect this to actually happen? Well, I'd like to hope not. But I've had more than my fair share of both good and bad experiences from this community alone myself, and its starting to make me feel bitter in general. Right around when I was getting my passion back, I see another thing like this that absolutely needs to be discussed.
Right. Back on track. I think there needs to be a discussion about pushing in bans for things like this. I also am not a fan of retroactively changing ones punishments. This is probably clear from the last few walls, But I want to reiterate
I do not know the full details, But I am of the opinion that Hoot should not have been re-banned for somthing they've already done.
One of the GMs, amidst the chaos of the discord discourse, mentioned that the information is already out there, and that you cant really take that back. Theres no taking back the pain of things that happened in the past-- or could possibly be happening now. I think Doxxing should absolutely be a permenant ban without any tolerance. However, Back then, it -was- tolerated. Going back and changing that now opens a whole can of worms, And I am unsure who it really helps. I feel going forward, Firstly, The ban on Hoot should absolutely be reversed if they were not using the information in question from the doxxing since their ban.
Secondly, If anyone -was- using the information in question other than Hoot, it'd probably be a better avenue of punishment. I cant exactly say whats right or wrong. Im not really a GM, But I feel this is the most fair. But my opinion, in all honesty, after all this time of trying to appeal these things, probably doesn't matter whatsoever.
And uh.. I think thats it. Thats all I got. Hopefully Im not putting myself on the firing line for having the possibly wrong opinion or being abit on the emotional side of things again. At the very least I hope this kicks off productive discussion as opposed to my usual expectation